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Old 08-04-2011, 05:59 PM   #1
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Default Mash schedule

Getting ready to brew my first AG this weekend and was doing some prep work during lunch. I am brewing a kit (5 Gallon 1554 clone) from AHS that has directions for fly sparging and I am going to be doing batch sparging. The calculator from here says I will need 3.65 gallons of mash water at 165 degrees and then I will need 5 gallons of sparge water (I assume at 185 degrees). I have read that it may be a good idea to try and have the water additons as close to the same "weight" as possible. Should I adjust my mash thickness higher? Also, I am unclear on how a mash out works and if it would even be benefitial for batch sparging. Any benefit to trying to raise the temp of the mash to 165 before first runnings? One other question... how long to let the sparge water sit before vaurluf (sp?)?

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Old 08-04-2011, 06:07 PM   #2
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How long is the boil? If it is a 60 minute boil, you are going have too much of pre-boil volume with about 8.5 gallons and will probably need to use between 3.5 and 4 gallons (that answers your question about water additions!) for a total of about 7.5 gallons pre-boil If it is a 90 minute boil you might be ok. I think 185 is too high for sparge water. I always have my sparge water at 170. If you are batch sparging, the mash out is not completely neccessary. Filling the mash tun with the first batch of sparge water will do the same thing as a mash out. Finally, let the sparge water sit in the tun for about 15 minutes each batch.

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Old 08-04-2011, 06:38 PM   #3
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Batch sparging is mostly fill, stir, vorlauf and drain. Never saw any difference from letting the sparge water sit in the tun for any length of time. I've mashed out when using a RIMS recirculation but never with a batch sparge only. Use one of the online calculators if you don't have software to determine your sparge water temp. Sparge water as above poster mentions at 170F is not hot enough to get your wort/grains up to high 160's, which is what you want. I've used 190 to 200+ in the past depending on batch size.

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Old 08-04-2011, 08:05 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by samc View Post
Batch sparging is mostly fill, stir, vorlauf and drain. Never saw any difference from letting the sparge water sit in the tun for any length of time. I've mashed out when using a RIMS recirculation but never with a batch sparge only. Use one of the online calculators if you don't have software to determine your sparge water temp. Sparge water as above poster mentions at 170F is not hot enough to get your wort/grains up to high 160's, which is what you want. I've used 190 to 200+ in the past depending on batch size.
So, I should have target temps on the order of: 152 (mash) and 165 (sparge)? I am confident in the water/temp calculations for the mash, but will have to figure out the temp of the water needed for the sparge to hit my target temp. Not sure I have seen anything that tells you the temp of sparge water you need that assumes a drained mash at x temperature.
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Old 08-04-2011, 09:38 PM   #5
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I use Beer Tools Pro, but you can find a lot of free ones like http://www.brew365.com/mash_sparge_water_calculator.php. In my older system I usually had 30+ gallons of grains and needed to add 195F water to get me to 170F. When I recirculated I could go in lower because I was using the RIMS heater to bring temps up to 170F.

Not sure if that is the correct one I referenced. You might need to use software and dial in all the numbers of your system based upon what you are using. Post up your equipment and maybe it is similar to someone elses setup who can give you a ballpark number.

edit - this seems more like it http://www.brewheads.com/batch.php

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Old 08-04-2011, 10:18 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samc View Post
I use Beer Tools Pro, but you can find a lot of free ones like http://www.brew365.com/mash_sparge_water_calculator.php. In my older system I usually had 30+ gallons of grains and needed to add 195F water to get me to 170F. When I recirculated I could go in lower because I was using the RIMS heater to bring temps up to 170F.

Not sure if that is the correct one I referenced. You might need to use software and dial in all the numbers of your system based upon what you are using. Post up your equipment and maybe it is similar to someone elses setup who can give you a ballpark number.

edit - this seems more like it http://www.brewheads.com/batch.php
I used the brew365 calculator... seems pretty good to me, but didn't have anything about sparge water temp. Correct me if I am wrong... but I don't want to go over 170 when sparging.... so getting sparge water to 170 would probably be ok, assuming it will lose a few degrees when mixing with the drained grains.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:31 PM   #7
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Post your grain bill and equipment please it will help us help you. . . your numbers look mostly accurate. I don't mash out when I batch sparge but some people do, it's your choice really since there are pros and cons to each. Some people claim extra efficiency when mashing out but it takes extra time and since I haven't installed a site glass on my boil kettle yet skipping a mash out makes calculating my sparge addition a little easier. The single most important thing to either mash out or sparge temps is bring the grain bed temp up but not over 170. Normally I wait 5 to 10 min after stirring to let the grain bed settle before vorlauf. Also, your mash addition may not always be but sometimes will be equal to your sparge addition, again grain bill will help us with this.

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Old 08-04-2011, 10:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbuquerqueJoe View Post
How long is the boil? If it is a 60 minute boil, you are going have too much of pre-boil volume with about 8.5 gallons and will probably need to use between 3.5 and 4 gallons (that answers your question about water additions!) for a total of about 7.5 gallons pre-boil If it is a 90 minute boil you might be ok. I think 185 is too high for sparge water. I always have my sparge water at 170. If you are batch sparging, the mash out is not completely neccessary. Filling the mash tun with the first batch of sparge water will do the same thing as a mash out. Finally, let the sparge water sit in the tun for about 15 minutes each batch.
That assumes that the grains and hops do not absorb any water, that you don't have any dead space in the equipment, and that you don't leave anything behind in the kettle to account for trub.
You will lose about 5 qt water to grain absorption, and I lose about another 2 qt to dead space in the MLT. That would leave me with almost 7g pre-boil which is what I need for a 5g batch. However, most people seem to need about 6.25 or 6.5g pre-boil, so the sparge water will probably be a bit high.

There is no benefit to using equal volumes of mash and sparge water. If you are batch sparging in two batches, you should try to keep the amount of water for the two sparge batches approximately equal.

-a.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:49 PM   #9
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Quote:
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That assumes that the grains and hops do not absorb any water, that you don't have any dead space in the equipment, and that you don't leave anything behind in the kettle to account for trub.
You will lose about 5 qt water to grain absorption, and I lose about another 2 qt to dead space in the MLT. That would leave me with almost 7g pre-boil which is what I need for a 5g batch. However, most people seem to need about 6.25 or 6.5g pre-boil, so the sparge water will probably be a bit high.

There is no benefit to using equal volumes of mash and sparge water. If you are batch sparging in two batches, you should try to keep the amount of water for the two sparge batches approximately equal.

-a.
+1, I didn't want to be the one who set the record straight but I'll agree with you that grain/hops absorption and dead space need to be accounted for all day
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:50 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by rjschroed View Post
Post your grain bill and equipment please it will help us help you. . . your numbers look mostly accurate. I don't mash out when I batch sparge but some people do, it's your choice really since there are pros and cons to each. Some people claim extra efficiency when mashing out but it takes extra time and since I haven't installed a site glass on my boil kettle yet skipping a mash out makes calculating my sparge addition a little easier. The single most important thing to either mash out or sparge temps is bring the grain bed temp up but not over 170. Normally I wait 5 to 10 min after stirring to let the grain bed settle before vorlauf. Also, your mash addition may not always be but sometimes will be equal to your sparge addition, again grain bill will help us with this.
Sorry...

I have a 7.5 gallon kettle (turkey fryer) & burner
immersion chiller
6.5 gallon fermentor
6.5 gallon bottling bucket
hydrometer
thermometer
7 gallon rectangle mash tun with copper manifold

I don't have the exact grain bill in front of me (it is from a kit), but I remember the grain volume...

11.69 lb grain with a target OG of 1.059

For the calculations on the websites (which are giving me different numbers by the way) I am assuming:
152 degree mash temp
1.25 mash thickness
70 degree grain temp
6.25 gallon pre-boil
5.25 post boil
.5 gallon trub loss (estimated)
.5 gallon mash tun loss (estimated, but will test)

for any other settings, I just take the default value (like grain obsorption).

/edit
oh... and 60 minute boil
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