Let's Partyyyy(gyle) that is!!!! Pumpkin Porter AND Ale from one mash!?! - Page 3

**Revvy** · 08-04-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freezeblade

Sounds about right to me, just remember that your house amber's not going to come out quite the same, and there's bound to be a little bit of variation (good or bad) as this is a first try doing this. I'd love to see how this turns out.

Yeah I figure...and I'm not expecting perfection with this...It's also another good reason why brewing this as two 2.5 gallon batches is appealing, both because it is less overall grain, less cost, and less crappy beer to have to choke down.

Now having read this article, I'm wondering something....Since the First beer will be in the range of Baltic Porter, if all the roasted grain WERE to go in the mashtun, if we follow this "dillution" from 1.080 in batch 1 to 1.054 in batch 2, and a lightenning in color...wouldn't it follow that the flavors would lighten as well? Wouldn't that mean conceivably that I would simply have a complexly flavored amber ale, with subtle notes of chocolate and roastiness?

**Revvy** · 08-04-2008, 05:54 PM

Hey Warped, et al...

I found a Party-gyle spreadsheet!!!

http://www.sonic.net/~ctweney/parti-gyle.xls

There's also a great faq here....http://www.antiochsudsuckers.com/tom/parti-gyle.htm

**Warped04** · 08-04-2008, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revvy

I found a Party-gyle spreadsheet!!!

Above and beyond the call of duty as always.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revvy

Wouldn't that mean conceivably that I would simply have a complexly flavored amber ale, with subtle notes of chocolate and roastiness?

Choking down the beer wouldn't be that bad. I'd let er rip and see what it tasted like.

**Revvy** · 08-05-2008, 03:05 PM

Owie My head is spinning from the maths...

Evidently working backward from the second running amber of 1.054...the first running porter would then be 1.081. Now if I am reading the articles correctly that would mean that the total batch recipe has to be 1.068.

So does that mean I have to create a base 6 gallon 1.068 recipe, which when split 50-50and boiled down to 2.5 gallons each will yield one beer @ 1.081 and one beer @ 1.054?

HELP ME!!!!!! Please????

I played around with Denny Conn's Baltic Porter Recipe, and brought it down to 1.082...

(2.5 gallon recipe)

Quote:

Amount Item Type % or IBU
5.50 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 70.97 %
0.75 lb Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 %
0.75 lb Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 %
0.25 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %
0.25 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %
0.25 lb Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %

Now do I have to build a 6 gallon 1.068 from this grainbill in order to figure out what exactly is going in the mash ton....

I'm lost...This reminds me of the 3 dimensional chess game from star trek, way too many variables for me...I have that choking sensation I use to get during math class when I was taking a test....

I haven't even factored in the pumpkin and spices, or the hops for either...But I figured I could do them separtely for each beer, because the pumpkin, spices and hops are all going into the boils...but I'm kind of stuck at this point in building the "master" grainbill...

Anyone???

EditI looked at the spreadsheet and it made me even more confused.....

**Warped04** · 08-05-2008, 04:46 PM

I finally took a look at the spreadsheet and that is a pretty complicated spreadsheet. I don't know much about this stuff, so let me read some of this and let me see if I at least can't be another set of eyes for you.

**Warped04** · 08-05-2008, 04:58 PM

Yeah. You are spot on. From all of that stuff it looks like you will be doing a 50/50 split of 1.068 wort. The first runnings should be around 1.0816 wort and the rest for the 1.0544 wort. That's with the same grain bill (for the first parti-gyle it sounds a lot simpler

).

I think that would put your grain bill:

Code:

10 lbs 15.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 70.97 % 
1 lbs 7.9 oz Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 % 
1 lbs 7.9 oz Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 % 
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 % 
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 % 
8.0 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %

**Warped04** · 08-05-2008, 05:12 PM

Wow...A triple post. I'm a bastard.

I found this spreadsheet. It's a little more user friendly and not so "takeoverish" as the other:

www.antiochsudsuckers.com/tom/Tom-OsParti-GyleCipherinSheet.xls

**Revvy** · 08-05-2008, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warped04

Yeah. You are spot on. From all of that stuff it looks like you will be doing a 50/50 split of 1.068 wort. The first runnings should be around 1.0816 wort and the rest for the 1.0544 wort. That's with the same grain bill (for the first parti-gyle it sounds a lot simpler

).

I think that would put your grain bill:

Code:

10 lbs 15.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 70.97 % 
1 lbs 7.9 oz Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 % 
1 lbs 7.9 oz Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 % 
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 % 
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 % 
8.0 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %

Did you just do this???? You Royally Rock!!!!!

I manged to finess Beersmith at the same time you were posting this and I got the same thing...For the lurkers I'll explain what I did.

1 took the 2.5 gallon Porter Recipe and scaled it to 6 gallons. Then I used the "Adjust Gravity" button and changed it to 1.068 and this is what I got...

Quote:

Recipe: Partigyle base
--------------------------
Batch Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Size: 6.87 gal
Estimated OG: 1.068 SG
Estimated Color: 26.7 SRM
Estimated IBU: 0.0 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
10.94 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 70.97 %
1.49 lb Brown Malt (65.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 %
1.49 lb Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 9.68 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 3.23%
0.50 lb Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3.23 %

Total Grain Weight: 15.41 lb

They nearly Match!!!!!!!!!

Great Minds!!!

**Warped04** · 08-05-2008, 05:47 PM

They are the same

. I just don't think in .4957 pounds so I display in pounds and ounces.

But I did the same thing you did in Beersmith.

I think you are good to go. I started reading all of this parti-gyle, and it looks like your second runnings are going to be basically a mild. I know they used to parti-gyle back in the day with first runnings a brown (before it started to transform / split off into porter) and the second runnings were a mild.

So I'd leave all of your "portery" stuff in there (not steep it), and see what happens. I'm thinking worst case scenario you can blend the two beers and you should end up with something drinkable.

I'm really thinking about trying this out (non-pumpkin). Parti-gyle sounds really complicated for a non-pro brewer like me

.

What are you going to ferment these in. Do you have 3 gallon carboys?

iamjonsharp · 08-05-2008, 05:56 PM

I read this the other day in Radical Brewing, and thought it would be helpful when doing parti-gyle batches:

From Radical Brewing by Randy Mosher, pg 201:

"Capping. This is a simple technique traditionally employed to boost the gravity of the third, small beer runnings of a parti-gyle batch. The malt of choice was traditionally amber (biscuit), which works well. Crystal malt works very well for this purpose, as it contains sugars in a soluble form, and requires no further mashing. The 'cap' malt is crushed as normal, then either strewn on the surface or stirred into the upper layer of the mash, allowed to rest fifteen minutes, then run off. This is a good tool for manipulating the character of the smaller beer by adding dark or other colored malts. Crystal works well in this situation as it needs no further mashing and can boost the body, useful for second-running beers."