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Old 09-06-2007, 01:52 AM   #11
rohanski
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newell456 get a grip! I think that after we start the homebrewing ang get hooked no matter what method we use we all become beer snobs. Be proud beer snob!

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Old 09-06-2007, 04:26 AM   #12
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What would be the maximum amount of grain I could PM and limit the boil size to 4 gallons? (I have a 22 qt. pan, don't think I can boil over 4 gal. without boilover).

If it takes 1.25 quarts of water per lb of grain to mash and another 2 quarts per lb to sparge, that's 3.25 quarts/lb. or .8 gallons/lb.

That comes out to 4 gallons of water per 5 lb of grain.

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Old 09-06-2007, 04:33 AM   #13
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I have been doing some partial mashes lately and doing 3.75 gallon boils. I end up with about 3 gallons of wort at the end, and I did notice a big difference in taste. I am also using liquid yeasts. All together, I notice a crisper taste and cleaner finish. I still have on really good extract recipe that I plan to keep making though.

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Old 09-06-2007, 07:02 AM   #14
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I have been doing PM's for the last 4 batches.

I mash in a 3 gallon beverage cooler, and use 6 lbs of grains. I typically end up with 3 gallons of wort.

I do a gravity reading of the wort contributed by the grains, and then do some fairly simple calculations to determine how much extract I need to add to hit my target gravity exactly.

I make sure that I have more extract on hand than my recipe conversion indicated in case my mash efficiency is considerbly off.

I have found a significant improvement in the quality of my beer since moving to PM and will move to AG in the next couple of months. I just need to work out some logistics as I am living in an apartment. I can make it work though as I have a 400 sf deck. I just need to find a way to plumb my immersion chiller to my roof top deck!

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Old 09-06-2007, 03:55 PM   #15
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I too want to say that PM beer does taste better. I don't know what it is, maybe I just got lucky, but so far all my PM's have been excellent. I have tried some small AG brews (as I don't have the full capacity of a AG brewer) and they taste great too! So far I can tell little difference between PM and AG, but maybe I am just not experienced enough!

Doing two more small AG's this weekend, then beginning in October, I'll be back to full 5.25 gallon PM brews. Fall is here and I am excited!!!

edit: oh, I forgot to say, in the PM brews, I use DME and not LME. Somehow it confirms to a lot I have read here on this site: that DME doesn't seem to have that twang.

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Old 09-06-2007, 04:18 PM   #16
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I've only done 3 PM batches, but I do think they were better than my 3 extract batches.

Look for AG and PM recipes. AG recipes are fairly easy to convert to PM recipes - you just substitute extract for most (not all) of the base malt. Software like BrewSmith (which is what I use - its only $20), can help with recipe formuation and figuring out how much water to use.

Go for it! You'll like it.

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Old 09-06-2007, 04:54 PM   #17
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Before giving you another opinion on PM vs Extract/w grains, I would rather know what you have brewed and what you didn't like about it?

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Old 09-07-2007, 03:10 AM   #18
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My first 2 batches of extra w/grain both have that "twang" My Brewers best kit for old english ale had a noticable twang after 2 weeks in the bottle. Now at 5 weeks, it is better, but still quite noticable.

My second batch was supposed to be a sam adams clone. I It has been bottled at room temp 2 weeks and now in the frig at 34 for a week. It has that same twang and really lacks the hop flavor of the boston lager.

I have an octoberfest which I just moved to secondary and when I sampled it, I noticed the twang again. Still have a ways to go on it though.

My main goal is to get rid of the twang. If I can do that by going to DME instead of liquid, that would be easier than doing a PM.

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Old 09-07-2007, 03:30 AM   #19
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From reading the forum it does seem that the twang is more present in LME so it might help to some degree to switch to DME.

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Old 09-07-2007, 12:32 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cos
My first 2 batches of extra w/grain both have that "twang" My Brewers best kit for old english ale had a noticable twang after 2 weeks in the bottle. Now at 5 weeks, it is better, but still quite noticable.

My second batch was supposed to be a sam adams clone. I It has been bottled at room temp 2 weeks and now in the frig at 34 for a week. It has that same twang and really lacks the hop flavor of the boston lager.

I have an octoberfest which I just moved to secondary and when I sampled it, I noticed the twang again. Still have a ways to go on it though.

My main goal is to get rid of the twang. If I can do that by going to DME instead of liquid, that would be easier than doing a PM.
Personally, I think a lot of this twang association with LME is coming more from using stale extract or folks scortching the LME than an inherent trait. When I used extract, the late addition method improved my brews.

Sure, try using DME and try a PM brew...try everything you can and see what works best. Having other brewers sample your beer and discuss your process can offer lots of good feedback too.
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