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Old 03-07-2014, 02:03 PM   #11
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What I've gathered from this forum is that FWH imparts a similar IBU as a 20 min addition, but with much more flavor/aroma.
That's not been my experience. Generally, FWH gives about 10% more IBUs than a traditional 60 minute addition, but it's much smoother in bittering.
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Old 03-08-2014, 11:29 AM   #12
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Thanks all! I subbed the 60 min. addition of my bittering with the FWH and even bumped it up to 1.25 oz. Hopefully it's a super smooth beer.

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Old 03-08-2014, 05:07 PM   #13
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I always use a 60 min. addition when I FWH. I don't find FWH in any way to be a sub for that addition. I think of it as for flavor, like a 20 min. addition. I caluclate the bitterness from FWH the same as a 20 min. addition, then I add enough more hops at 60 to get to the total IBU I'm going for. Sure, FWH calculates as more IBU than a 60 min, addition, but I generally brew beer to drink, not measure! I go for what it tastes like.

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Old 03-08-2014, 05:15 PM   #14
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I always use a 60 min. addition when I FWH. I don't find FWH in any way to be a sub for that addition. I think of it as for flavor, like a 20 min. addition. I caluclate the bitterness from FWH the same as a 20 min. addition, then I add enough more hops at 60 to get to the total IBU I'm going for. Sure, FWH calculates as more IBU than a 60 min, addition, but I generally brew beer to drink, not measure! I go for what it tastes like.
I guess I knew that Denny felt this way (but forgot)- and I totally respect his experience and opinions.

That goes to show you that everyone perceives things differently, including how much bitterness is "enough". Your taste buds (and those of your friends) are the only true judge of what is correct.

When I used both a 60 minute and a FWH addition, the beer wasn't "right" to me. More firmly bitter, but without the aroma and flavor I wanted. Perhaps it's the type of hops, but I've done it with high cohumulone hops like chinook, as well as with lower cohumulone hops like amarillo, and I still like the FWH instead of the bittering hops, not in addition to.

I still occasionally play with things like mash hopping, when I have homegrown or otherwise cheap hops, but haven't found that mash hopping gives as much hops flavor and aroma as I'd like, so I often do FWH and whirlpool additions in my hoppy beers. Maybe that's the difference in why I'm happy with the hops schedule I use of FWH/15/5/whirlpool/dryhop or something like that. I dunno.
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Old 03-08-2014, 05:25 PM   #15
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Yooper, my "normal" hop schedule is FWH, 60, and flameout.

Fortunately, there is a book coming out in Nov. that outlines experiments for deciding how YOU want to use FWH.

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Old 03-08-2014, 05:54 PM   #16
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Been trying to figure this out for the past few years. There’s so much information out there that you really have to try all the combinations and see what works for you. I wasn't getting the level or type of bitterness I wanted from just FWHing. There’s a compromise somewhere in between. Some smooth bitterness and some of the bite that only a 60 minute addition offers. The all late hop craze was even worse. For me, a lot of the new hop fads produced beers that were great at around week two or three, but dropped off fast. By four weeks from the brew day, flavor and aroma was fading fast. And with no real bitterness, they lost all their appeal. At this point I'm very close to what Denny says, although I still add an ounce or so at 10 minutes. And you didn't mentioned it, but I’m assuming you're still dry hopping?

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Old 03-08-2014, 06:05 PM   #17
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Been trying to figure this out for the past few years. There’s so much information out there that you really have to try all the combinations and see what works for you. I wasn't getting the level or type of bitterness I wanted from just FWHing. There’s a compromise somewhere in between. Some smooth bitterness and some of the bite that only a 60 minute addition offers. The all late hop craze was even worse. For me, a lot of the new hop fads produced beers that were great at around week two or three, but dropped off fast. By four weeks from the brew day, flavor and aroma was fading fast. And with no real bitterness, they lost all their appeal. At this point I'm very close to what Denny says, although I still add an ounce or so at 10 minutes. And you didn't mentioned it, but I’m assuming you're still dry hopping?
Yep, I still dry hop. In fact, I fond that to be so much more effective than a flameout addition that I skip the flameout a lot of times. There are exceptions, though. I recently brewed the Hop Stoopid recipe from "Craft Beer for the Homebrewer" and I was astounded at how much aroma I got from the flameout. Of course, it was 3 oz. of hops like Simcoe and Chinook! And I still dry hopped it!
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