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Old 12-12-2012, 02:07 PM   #11
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Thanks. I think I'll try the partial boil, since I'm planning on a session beer that will be consumed a little more rapidly. I'll save the full boil for something a little more experimenty or strange.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:10 PM   #12
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Duplicate post.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:10 PM   #13
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You don't need to defend him, besides, basically he's saying you'll make crappy beer if you attempt it. It's one thing to offer information, it's another thing to offer opinion without stating that it is opinion.

I have found that in this hobby there are MANY ways of doing things, and that when someone is "so sure" that something won't work, he doesn't realize that there are folks who are doing it that way all the time, and it IS working. And used by a lot of people.

A lot of folks just repeat what they've heard, about something, without even experimenting for themselves. And USUALLY those things that folks are so convinced is "that way" like the hop utilization thing turns out to be so miniscule that our tastebuds really couldn't detect it anyway......

My primer covers any so called "dillution" of hops quite simply....As does most brewing software when you're working with dillution....

And the other questions remains, Have either of you ACTUALLY attempted it or are you just playing armchair brewer on this one? It's one thing to do it, and share info for or against it, and it's another thing to venture opinion without even having ever tried it.
Time to get very direct then...

What are we offering here if not opinions based on experience? I've tried both methods many times, and every method in between. I am not arguing that there are many ways of doing things. I know this. But topping off with 2.5 gallons of plain water and 2.5 gallons of concentrated wort does make inferior beer when compared to the same recipe brewed via a full volume boil. Fact... not to mention common sense. A new brewer shouldn't even need to think that hard to discern that.

It's a hack move at worst, and a move based on convenience & practicality at best. It does nothing to better your beer, but certainly effects the final quality. However, if you're satisfied with mediocre, then great. Say so. I still make powdered lemonade this way, but then again I don't really care for squeezing a dozen lemons.

And medals from bogus competetions mean nothing in the grand scheme of things. I don't see the need to boast about it. But in a blind taste test, and based on your full belief in partial boils, I would strip you of your medals. Challenge.
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:14 PM   #14
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Oh no he di'int...let the popcorn eating commence.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:18 PM   #15
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And medals from bogus competetions mean nothing in the grand scheme of things. I don't see the need to boast about it. But in a blind taste test, I would strip you of your medals. Challenge.
What's a bogus competition to you? In the Michigan State fair comp I went against over 50 IPAs alone and got number 4. The world expo of beer is now one of the largest comps in Michgan, capped out at 800 seperate entries.

I enter beers, especially experimental beers for feedback since we have several excellent BJCP judges in the Metro Detroit area, some Gran Master level, and many who travel and even judge commercial beers overseas, so I look at it as a good way to PROVE theories, or to see where something fails.

So to me, it's an excellent way to see if something works. And entering batches like that prove that good beer can be made different ways.....

Sounds like you can't handle someone calling you out. I'll ask you again, Have you ACTUALLY ever made a partial boil allgrain beer the way I mention?/ If not all you're doing is venturing an OPINION WITH NO PRACTICAL BASIS IN FACT.....So how is that helpful to someone, especially when OTHER folks prove that IT CAN BE DONE? And you know what they say about opinions

And I'm done with this, I don't argue with idiots.......
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:20 PM   #16
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I can tell you one thing, if I drank 50 IPAs back to back, my palate would be drained at discerning subtle nuances and particular flavors... and I'm a professional chef.

I'm talking about one beer, same recipe, two different brewers, one who hacks it and one who does it justice... blind taste test to see which is better. Challenge.

I'm sure you're a good guy, but we just see things from opposite ends of the spectrum. No need to get so heated about it. Just put your money where your mouth is.

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And I'm done with this, I don't argue with idiots.......
PS - I already answered the question you asked twice, idiot.

There have been a lot of new threads about this topic and old threads that can be viewed via the search history bar. There are those who think it matters, and those who do not (more so the former). So use the collective opinions based on experience to come to a conclusion, or continue to do what satisfies you. I honestly don't care.
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:33 PM   #17
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Guys, guys, I think we're all aware of the current opinions on wort gravity and volume not affecting hops utilization in the way we once thought. And this stuff about an inferior beer being made when you top off a batch is pure poppycock, IMO and experience. I did partial boils on my 5 gal AG batches for quite some time before getting a big enough kettle to do full boils. None of those batches were any worse for wear than the ones I make now doing full boils with no top up.

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:35 PM   #18
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I can tell you one thing, if I drank 50 IPAs back to back, my palate would be drained at discerning subtle nuances and particular flavors... and I'm a professional chef.
Are you like 15 years old? Where do you get this stuff? How do you know that it was just one set of judges handling all 50, how do you know it wasn't multiple pairs of judges dividing the flight up? How do you know if it was done over the same day, or broken down over multiple days to prevent judges from having "drained palates?" How do you know anything about how any beers were judged? First you said these contest were "bogus" until I pointed out what they were, THEN you came up with this?

You're just digging you're own hole, dude....you could have just agreed to disagree and moved on. You could have just said "hey, wow, I guess people are doing it this way, and making ok beer with it.....Maybe I was wrong...." The point IS, you expressed an OPINION that sounded like a fact, and when confronted you got all defensive. All you had to do was not be defensive and said, "this is my opinion" or "this is what I've heard or read...."

Geez.....
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:39 PM   #19
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Here's a question. How is it common sense that partial boils would make inferior beer? In what way does diluting a solution reduce the quality? Especially if it is accounted for in the recipe. Working in a lab, almost every single solution we use is made or purchased at concentrations much higher than the working concentration, sometimes thousands of times higher. If diluting a solution in exacting scientific research, where a single microliter can make a difference in success or failure, is everyday practice, what difference is it going to make in home brewing beer on a scale of gallons?

Just my .02

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Old 12-12-2012, 02:39 PM   #20
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Revvy, Revvy, Revvy... You keep finding ways to avoid the challenge. Someone wanna set something up that's completely blind and fair?

I'm down. As I've said, put your money where your mouth is


PS - You asked for more detailed directness, so I gave it to you. You could have took my opinion (based on my experience) and ignored or acknowledged it politely, but you didnt.

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