Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Last Sponsor Giveaway of the Year!

Come Enter the BrewDeals/FastFerment Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing > Efficiency
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 07-21-2008, 08:13 PM   #1
jmmarvel
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 55
Default Efficiency

So here's the word's stupidest question. How do you measure efficiency? I see a lot of posts boasting about high efficiency, but I'm pretty lost on how it's calculated or estimated. Any beginner info on efficiency would be great. If there's a page or a site or whatever that explains a lot, that would be as good as anything. I've only done Partial mash but I just got my 10g brewpot and am looking to do my first AG this weekend. Danke.

__________________
jmmarvel is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-21-2008, 08:26 PM   #2
stever
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 534
Liked 4 Times on 4 Posts

Default

A few searches would bring up these and quite a bit more.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Efficiency

or you can use a calculator like this

__________________

"24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case. Coincidence?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by MVKTR2 View Post
Can't believe I'm saying this, but Great Cock man!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurel View Post
yeah, i've got big balls
stever is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-21-2008, 08:46 PM   #3
Bobby_M
Vendor and Brewer
HBT_SPONSOR.png
Vendor Ads 
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Bobby_M's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Whitehouse Station, NJ
Posts: 22,188
Liked 1042 Times on 696 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

And you can read this:

http://www.suebob.com/brew/allgrain.htm

__________________
BrewHardware.com has a new website. Please check it out and let me know what you think!
New Stainless Steel Heating Elements are IN!
Did you know we are now a full service homebrew shop selling malt, hops, yeast (Wyeast), etc?
Bobby_M is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-21-2008, 11:29 PM   #4
Willie3
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Willie3's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Hackettstown, New Jersey
Posts: 769
Liked 7 Times on 4 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

OK so I understand the efficiency and I know how to measure from the max ratio however I am confused on one item and I cannot seem to find the answers I am looking for. In a nut shell when I mash I usually mash ten pounds. I know my system requires 7 gallons to boil to 5.5 in 1.5 hours. So I try to arrange it so I end up with 7 gallons pre boil. But I think that I am over mashing and sparging and I think its hurting my outcome.

Say that I prefer a stiff mash of 1 quart of water/pound of grain. For 8 pounds of grain (using a different mash size than previously mentioned) the amount of water for the mash comes to 2 gallons of water for the mash. To sparge (batch) I would use 2 quarts per pound which comes to 5 gallons split in two separate sparges of 2.5 gallons each. So far total water used is 7 gallons of which I collected 5.5 due to loss from grain absorption etc. So for a pre boil gravity I hit 85%. see figure 1 below:

Fig 1.

Pale Malt = 38 ppg x #s used (6) / 5.5gal = ~42 points

Crystal 10 = 34 ppg x #'s used (1) / 5.5gal = ~6.2 points

Carapils = 32 ppg x #'s used (1) / 5.5gal = ~5.8 points

So my Pre Boil Gravity Max Target comes to 42 + 6.2 + 5.8 = 54 points or 1.054 @ 100% of the available sugars. So 85% percent of this figure is 43 or 1.043.

Here is where I am lost. Since I require a total amount of boil volume to be 7 gallons I need to add 1.5 gallons to the collection. When I do this How do I add the 1.5 gallons back into the equation to understand what my efficiency is? Do I figure the pre boil volume at 7 gallons? Or do I need to wait until the boil is complete and then take a measure. Hmmm. If my preboil wort volume is 5.5 and it is suppose to be 43 points at best case scenario it should be the same when I am finished if I add 1.5 gallons and then boil it down to 5.5. If this is correct maybe I just answered my question.

Can anyone let me know if this is the case?

Thanks

- WW

__________________

Willie3

NJ HOPZ - North Jersey Homebrewers Organization of Praciticing Zymurgisits

FINAL GRAVITY PODCAST PERSONALITY

I brew therefor I am!

Willie3 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-21-2008, 11:47 PM   #5
z987k
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
z987k's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Anchorage
Posts: 3,544
Liked 23 Times on 21 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

http://www.howtobrew.com/section2/chapter12-5.html
z987k is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-22-2008, 12:36 AM   #6
carnevoodoo
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 4,305
Liked 13 Times on 12 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Efficiency is a myth like hot side aeration and bigfoot. I wouldn't worry about it too much.

__________________
carnevoodoo is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-22-2008, 12:53 AM   #7
Bobby_M
Vendor and Brewer
HBT_SPONSOR.png
Vendor Ads 
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Bobby_M's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Whitehouse Station, NJ
Posts: 22,188
Liked 1042 Times on 696 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

Efficiency is a myth? It's a measured thing, like gravity or temperature.

Willie, the reason you're having trouble is you need to think in two different modes, one is mash/lauter and the other is brewhouse. If you're working with preboil wort, all calculations have to be done with a measured preboil volume. In your calculation above, you were figuring out brewhouse by using the finished volume of 5.5 gallons.

If you want to figure for preboil, you have to use the higher volume (7gallons in your calculations).

Pale Malt = 38 ppg x #s used (6) / 7gal = ~32.5 points

Crystal 10 = 34 ppg x #'s used (1) / 7gal = ~4.8 points

Carapils = 32 ppg x #'s used (1) / 7gal = ~4.5 points

That's a total of 41.8 points measured at 7 gallons preboil at 100% extract.

My only other point to make is that you shouldn't sparge based on a fixed water/grain ratio. Sparge to reach the desired preboil volume. If you have to measure your first runnings to find out what that volume of sparge water needs to be, do it.

__________________
BrewHardware.com has a new website. Please check it out and let me know what you think!
New Stainless Steel Heating Elements are IN!
Did you know we are now a full service homebrew shop selling malt, hops, yeast (Wyeast), etc?

Bobby_M is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-22-2008, 01:55 AM   #8
Willie3
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Willie3's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Hackettstown, New Jersey
Posts: 769
Liked 7 Times on 4 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Bobby,

Thanks for the tip. Hey I'm from Hackettstown. Next time we brew maybe we can make a day of it together with my brother-in-law who is also a brewer.

Let me know.

- WW

__________________

Willie3

NJ HOPZ - North Jersey Homebrewers Organization of Praciticing Zymurgisits

FINAL GRAVITY PODCAST PERSONALITY

I brew therefor I am!

Willie3 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-22-2008, 03:22 AM   #9
ajf
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
ajf's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Long Island
Posts: 4,643
Liked 99 Times on 93 Posts
Likes Given: 39

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
My only other point to make is that you shouldn't sparge based on a fixed water/grain ratio. Sparge to reach the desired preboil volume. If you have to measure your first runnings to find out what that volume of sparge water needs to be, do it.
I completely agree with this. In your example, you would need to sparge with two batches of 3.25g sparge water to achieve the pre-boil volume of 7g. If you want to sparge with twice the amount of sparge water, you would need to add an extra 0.5g mash water, and 2 batches of 3g sparge water.
On the other hand, I prefer your method of determining your mash/lauter efficiency. It's what Promash does, and the way I calculate it. Both methods however are flawed in that they don't take the moisture content of the grain into account.

-a.
__________________
ajf is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-22-2008, 02:47 PM   #10
Willie3
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Willie3's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Hackettstown, New Jersey
Posts: 769
Liked 7 Times on 4 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

If you sparge with too much water wouldn't you leech tannins?

-WW

__________________

Willie3

NJ HOPZ - North Jersey Homebrewers Organization of Praciticing Zymurgisits

FINAL GRAVITY PODCAST PERSONALITY

I brew therefor I am!

Willie3 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
5th AG, 55% Efficiency magnj All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 7 05-03-2009 07:09 PM
New Low in efficiency jma99 All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 4 09-01-2008 04:56 PM
Need help with first AG efficiency Soulive All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 50 12-10-2007 04:22 PM
first Ag why such a low efficiency jblewis All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 9 03-18-2007 01:47 AM
Is this efficiency right? Gabe All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 7 02-19-2007 05:11 AM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS