Ss Brewing Technologies Giveaway!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing > 5.2 and CO2 Off Flavor
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-24-2010, 01:30 AM   #1
mlaw06
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Richmond, VA / Gainesville, FL
Posts: 59
Default 5.2 and CO2 Off Flavor

I've brewed 21 all grain batches with great results and have never worried about my mash pH until recently. I added 1 tablespoon of Five Star's 5.2 mash stabilizer to each of my last two beers, an ESB and American Amber. Before kegging, both beers tasted young but right where they should be. Once kegged, I hooked both up to CO2 at 12 psi for a week. Upon tasting both after a week, I noticed that they developed an awful metallic mineral like taste that was not there at kegging. Since I brew 6 gallon batches, I always have some leftover in the fermenter once the keg is full, so I fill up a couple of bombers just to have around. I also tried the bombers of uncarbonated beer, and none of them have developed the terrible flavor that the kegs did.

My sanitation practices are sound, and have never had the slightest infection. I have full fermentation temperature control, so that is not a factor either.

The only thing that makes any sense to me is that adding CO2 (carbonic acid with a pH around 4 at a pressure of 12 psi) to the beer is activating the buffer in 5.2 and producing this flavor.

If anyone has had this experience or can lend any insight, it would be greatly appreciated.

__________________
mlaw06 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 01:51 AM   #2
BigEd
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,350
Liked 114 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 17

Default

Two questions: 1) If you hadn't had any problems why did you decide to add this product to your beer? 2) Do you know what your water analysis profile is?

The 5.2 stuff is metallic phosphate salts, probably either sodium or potassium. (The manufacturer doesn't say what is in it exactly) Potentially, the ions in the 5.2 combined with metallic ions already in your brewing water resulted in enough of something to create a noticeable off flavor accented by the CO2.

__________________
BigEd is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 01:57 AM   #3
mlaw06
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Richmond, VA / Gainesville, FL
Posts: 59
Default

1) I'm an idiot and like messing with things, even when they're fine. I figured the buffer would be harmless since no huge pH swings would be seen.

2) Unfortunately, I do not know my water profile.

Maybe this will just be a tough lesson in not tinkering.

__________________
mlaw06 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 02:24 AM   #4
BigEd
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,350
Liked 114 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 17

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlaw06 View Post
1) I'm an idiot and like messing with things, even when they're fine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mlaw06 View Post
2) Unfortunately, I do not know my water profile.
Do yourself and your beer a favor and find out. This is something that you should have if brewing all grain.
__________________
BigEd is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 01:49 PM   #5
david_42
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
david_42's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Willamina & Oak Grove, Oregon, USA
Posts: 25,651
Liked 134 Times on 127 Posts

Default

I've been using pH5.2 for years and keg. I've have never noticed any metallic flavors. Since I often take beer to club meetings, I'm certain someone would have mentioned it. The pH of naturally carbonated and force carbonated beer doesn't vary much.

It is certainly possible that something in your water is reacting with the pH5.2, so getting the profile would be a good idea.

__________________

Remember one unassailable statistic, as explained by the late, great George Carlin: "Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!"

"I would like to die on Mars, just not on impact." Elon Musk


Last edited by david_42; 02-24-2010 at 01:52 PM.
david_42 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 05:19 PM   #6
Bobby_M
Vendor and Brewer
HBT_SPONSOR.png
Vendor Ads 
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Bobby_M's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Whitehouse Station, NJ
Posts: 22,017
Liked 979 Times on 654 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

You're probably picking up some of the initial carbonic acid that is created as CO2 dissolves. It's worse in the first week or so of kegging when most of the co2 is dissolved. The acid will dissipate after some time which is why I never drink beer that I've recently put on the gas..

__________________
BrewHardware.com
Sightglass, Refractometer, Ball Valve, Weldless bulkhead, Thermometer, Decals, Stainless Steel Fittings, Compression Fittings, Camlock Quick Disconnects, Scale, RIMS tube, Plate Chiller, Chugger Pump, Super Clear Silicone Tubing, and more!

New Stuff?
Bobby_M is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 06:14 PM   #7
BuzzCraft
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Blacksburg, VA
Posts: 426
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
You're probably picking up some of the initial carbonic acid that is created as CO2 dissolves. It's worse in the first week or so of kegging when most of the co2 is dissolved. The acid will dissipate after some time which is why I never drink beer that I've recently put on the gas..
huh....that's interesting and useful information. can't believe i've never heard of this before.
__________________
BuzzCraft is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-24-2010, 06:57 PM   #8
Bobby_M
Vendor and Brewer
HBT_SPONSOR.png
Vendor Ads 
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Bobby_M's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Whitehouse Station, NJ
Posts: 22,017
Liked 979 Times on 654 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

I should disclose that I'm not a chemist so I could be completely wrong on this one. I just know that I get the same metallic taste when I first put the gas on.

__________________
BrewHardware.com
Sightglass, Refractometer, Ball Valve, Weldless bulkhead, Thermometer, Decals, Stainless Steel Fittings, Compression Fittings, Camlock Quick Disconnects, Scale, RIMS tube, Plate Chiller, Chugger Pump, Super Clear Silicone Tubing, and more!

New Stuff?
Bobby_M is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-25-2010, 12:22 AM   #9
mlaw06
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Richmond, VA / Gainesville, FL
Posts: 59
Default

Yea I'm going to let both mature for a few weeks and see how they are then. I did get feedback from someone who got that metallic taste when there was some residual PBW left in the keg after cleaning. I wash my kegs with PBW and thought I rinsed thoroughly, but maybe I'm not rinsing enough.

__________________
mlaw06 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-25-2010, 12:49 AM   #10
StAnthonyB
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 326
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
I should disclose that I'm not a chemist so I could be completely wrong on this one. I just know that I get the same metallic taste when I first put the gas on.
Bobby is spot on with this one. I've noticed that taste too. It definitely goes away after a week or so.
__________________
StAnthonyB is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Tags
5.2, buffer, co2, off flavor

Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Early boil hop flavor VS late boil hop flavor NAVET Recipes/Ingredients 15 03-08-2011 06:41 PM
off flavor help!!!! dirtyd49 General Beer Discussion 7 12-20-2009 07:35 PM
No flavor Vanawaggin Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 3 11-16-2009 07:37 PM
MY IPA flavor nyer Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 7 02-13-2008 06:04 PM
Flavor changes when kegging/bottling... (flavor demolition) parasonic Bottling/Kegging 3 12-13-2006 03:56 AM