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Old 08-24-2012, 12:08 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by ronan View Post
Attachment 72828

Finally after a de-carbination and 42 psi of beer gas we have a near perfect pour.
beautiful pour! glad you finally got it worked out.

Would you mind throwing my numbers in your spreadsheat?

I think my fridge is about 38 as well but my altitude is around 2,600 feet.

ABV ~ 6.5


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Old 08-24-2012, 12:42 AM   #22
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I got the calc from here. It actually suggested 47 PSI on beer gas but at 44 it blew one of the ball locks off the corny. I'm satisfied at 42 might try dropping it by a few LBs just to see if there is a noticeable change in the pour quality.

http://mcdantim.com/distributor-tools/calculators/



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Old 08-24-2012, 02:46 AM   #23
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Finally after a de-carbination and 42 psi of beer gas we have a near perfect pour.
Good deal. Looks tasty too.

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Originally Posted by beaksnbeer View Post
Stout taps because of the restricter plate do not need long beer line for balance
More or less. They usually work best with 10-40 psi at the restrictor plate, so there are some rare instances where changing the line length or diameter can be helpful.

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Originally Posted by ronan View Post
I got the calc from here. It actually suggested 47 PSI on beer gas but at 44 it blew one of the ball locks off the corny. I'm satisfied at 42 might try dropping it by a few LBs just to see if there is a noticeable change in the pour quality.

http://mcdantim.com/distributor-tools/calculators/
The 47 psi the calculator came up with is what will keep perfect equilibrium with your carbonation level. Unlike when using 100% CO2, this isn't all that important when using beer gas. Because of the high pressures and the nitrogen, very little of the CO2 will come out of solution if you use lower than the equilibrium pressure. Even at 35-40 psi the amount of carbonation you'd lose over the course of the keg would be so small that most people couldn't tell the difference.
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Old 08-24-2012, 10:12 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Golddiggie View Post
Yes it can be correct. Since you have just 25% CO2 in the gas mix, you're at 1/4 what you would have with straight CO2. The 47psi will put you at just under 12psi equivalent. You might need to get a longer beer line for that faucet too. I won't say for certain since I've not [yet] set up to serve via a stout tap on beer gas.
This is a decent rule of thumb, but it's not exactly 1/4 equivalence... The pressure on a regulator gauge is zeroed at 1 atmosphere, meaning that if your gauge reads 0.1 it is actually already applying 14.8 (1 atmosphere + .1) pounds of pressure. 1/4 of the gas "below" the 0 point in the gauge is also CO2, so you have to account for that in the calculation.

Point being, if you're looking for 2.27 volumes CO2 (12psig at 40º on pure CO2) and serving on beer gas, you're going to end up with less and less dissolved CO2 over the course of the keg. The gas equivalences can be found with these formulas, though:

To find the equivalent pressure for beer gas to give the same CO2 content as pure CO2:
Pbeergas = (Pco2 +14.7) / (% CO2 in Mix) - 14.7

E.g., a mix of 25%CO2/75% N2 would give the same CO2 pressure as 12 psig of pure CO2 at:
= (12+14.7)/(.25) -14.7
= 92.1 psig of beergas
*note: psig = psi of gauge, v. psia = psi absolute
And to find out how much applied pressure the CO2 in a mixed gas is applying on the beer, just reverse it (the 47psi is from your beergas setting):
Papplied = (% CO2 in Mix) * (Pbeergas +14.7) - 14.7
= .25 * (47 + 14.7) - 14.7
= 0.725 psig of CO2
You'll notice that under the serving pressures for beer gas, 30 to 45 psig works out to -3.525 psig (or 11.18 psia) of CO2 to 0.225 psig (14.92 psia) of applied CO2. At 40º, this works out to 0.83 to 1.18 volumes of CO2. The fact you can have less than one atmosphere of applied CO2 pressure with beer gas is why you can get these low volumes - at the same temperature, 0.1 psig (just barely moving the needle) on a pure CO2 gas will only get you down to 1.17 volumes CO2.


TL/DR version: Set your beer gas to 30-40 psig and you'll end up with between .8 and 1.2 volumes of CO2. Don't expect to get the same dissolved CO2 as a pure gas unless you really pump up the applied pressure, though...
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Old 10-03-2012, 02:02 AM   #25
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So now that I have the perfect blend of carbing with conjunction of pressure I beginning to realize mixed beergas does not give you the milage CO2 does. I going through a 5LB tank in less than one corny. Does this sound right? Basically is its like a 1$ of gas per pint at the moment.

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Old 10-03-2012, 02:08 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by ronan
So now that I have the perfect blend of carbing with conjunction of pressure I beginning to realize mixed beergas does not give you the milage CO2 does. I going through a 5LB tank in less than one corny. Does this sound right? Basically is its like a 1$ of gas per pint at the moment.
You have a leak somewhere. Submerge everything you can in a bucket/tub/etc. Spray everything else with star-san.
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Old 10-20-2012, 02:21 AM   #27
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Ok one last question. I just legged a really nice irish red ale that I would like to put on nitro in short time. My newer process is carb at 1.5 PSI on co2 for about a week while the beer is at 37ish degrees. I do this before putting on nitro and the results have been decent. I would however like to serve this up for some friends tomorrow any suggestions to get this moving quicker. Can I do the shake and role with beer gas ? As of now it has some minor carbonation and it does pour at high pressure but no cascade or head.

Thanks

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Old 03-28-2013, 03:14 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by jwbeard View Post
This is a decent rule of thumb, but it's not exactly 1/4 equivalence... The pressure on a regulator gauge is zeroed at 1 atmosphere, meaning that if your gauge reads 0.1 it is actually already applying 14.8 (1 atmosphere + .1) pounds of pressure. 1/4 of the gas "below" the 0 point in the gauge is also CO2, so you have to account for that in the calculation.

Point being, if you're looking for 2.27 volumes CO2 (12psig at 40º on pure CO2) and serving on beer gas, you're going to end up with less and less dissolved CO2 over the course of the keg. The gas equivalences can be found with these formulas, though:

To find the equivalent pressure for beer gas to give the same CO2 content as pure CO2:
Pbeergas = (Pco2 +14.7) / (% CO2 in Mix) - 14.7

E.g., a mix of 25%CO2/75% N2 would give the same CO2 pressure as 12 psig of pure CO2 at:
= (12+14.7)/(.25) -14.7
= 92.1 psig of beergas
*note: psig = psi of gauge, v. psia = psi absolute
And to find out how much applied pressure the CO2 in a mixed gas is applying on the beer, just reverse it (the 47psi is from your beergas setting):
Papplied = (% CO2 in Mix) * (Pbeergas +14.7) - 14.7
= .25 * (47 + 14.7) - 14.7
= 0.725 psig of CO2
You'll notice that under the serving pressures for beer gas, 30 to 45 psig works out to -3.525 psig (or 11.18 psia) of CO2 to 0.225 psig (14.92 psia) of applied CO2. At 40º, this works out to 0.83 to 1.18 volumes of CO2. The fact you can have less than one atmosphere of applied CO2 pressure with beer gas is why you can get these low volumes - at the same temperature, 0.1 psig (just barely moving the needle) on a pure CO2 gas will only get you down to 1.17 volumes CO2.


TL/DR version: Set your beer gas to 30-40 psig and you'll end up with between .8 and 1.2 volumes of CO2. Don't expect to get the same dissolved CO2 as a pure gas unless you really pump up the applied pressure, though...
My head hurts.


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