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Old 08-12-2010, 10:07 AM   #11
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One more thing I feel I must mention before I head to the land of slumber: So I always make a point of giving a bottled beer a visual inspection every couple of days as it matures - and I spotted something different with this particular batch. Despite the fact that it was the clearest beer I had brewed by the time secondary stint had ended, within a few days of being bottled to my total disbelief I could see minute particles suspended and circulating in the bottle (seemed to be collecting towards the bottle neck). I had never seen this in any other batch (perhaps never noticed it in any other batch?) but i considered this a contributing factor to my "picked up an infection in the bottling process theory"
thanks

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Old 08-12-2010, 12:28 PM   #12
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One more thing I feel I must mention before I head to the land of slumber: So I always make a point of giving a bottled beer a visual inspection every couple of days as it matures - and I spotted something different with this particular batch. Despite the fact that it was the clearest beer I had brewed by the time secondary stint had ended, within a few days of being bottled to my total disbelief I could see minute particles suspended and circulating in the bottle (seemed to be collecting towards the bottle neck). I had never seen this in any other batch (perhaps never noticed it in any other batch?) but i considered this a contributing factor to my "picked up an infection in the bottling process theory"
thanks
It sounds like yeast, working to carbonate your beer. Give it at least another week or so and try another bottle then.

Sometimes it is carbed up in a week or two, sometimes in three or four. It doesn't mean anything is wrong- it just takes a bit longer sometimes. Give it at least three weeks at 21C or higher and try it again.
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Old 08-12-2010, 12:57 PM   #13
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There's really nothing wrong with your beer, except that you opened them too soon, they're not ready yet.

The 3 weeks at 70 degrees, that that we recommend is the minimum time it takes for average gravity beers to carbonate and condition. Higher grav beers take longer.

Stouts and porters have taken me between 6 and 8 weeks to carb up..I have a 1.090 Belgian strong that took three months to carb up.

Temp and gravity are the two factors that contribute to the time it takes to carb beer. But if a beer's not ready yet, or seems low carbed, and you added the right amount of sugar to it, then it's not stalled, it's just not time yet.

Everything you need to know about carbing and conditioning, can be found here Of Patience and Bottle Conditioning. With emphasis on the word, "patience."

The other factor is that you are using 16 ouncers, and that adds more time to the necessary wait period. I have some pints, 22 oz bombers and other sizes that I often use, but since I enter contests I usually also do a sixer or two of standard 12 ouncers for entering. And inevitably the 12 ouncers are done at least a week faster than the larger bottles....some times two weeks ahead of time...

Also the rule of thumb is 3 weeks at 70 degrees for a normal grav 12 ounce bottle....to carb and condition....It takes longer for the yeasties to convert the larger volume in the bigger bottles to enough co2 in the headspace to be reabsorbed back into the solution...A ration I don't know how much...

Big Kahuna gives a good explanation here...

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Originally Posted by BigKahuna View Post
Simple. It's the ration of contact area just like in a keg. The c02 will need to pressurize the head space (Which takes LESS TIME) in a bigger bottle (More Yeast and sugar, roughly the same head space) but then it has to force that c02 into solution through the same contact area...thus it takes longer.
Really just give your beer a couple more weeks, and they should be fine. By doing the prime tabs, you pretty much gaurenteed yourself that you did it right. You added the same amount of sugar to each bottle. That makes it pretty foolproof, which means, barring any bad seal on those grolsh bottles, they will carb up eventually.


If a beer isn't carbed by "x number of weeks" you just have to give them ore time. If you added your sugar, then the beer will carb up eventually, it's really a foolroof process. All beers will carb up eventually. A lot of new brewers think they have to "troubleshoot" a bottling issue, when there really is none, the beer knows how to carb itself. In fact if you run beersmiths carbing calculator, some lower grav beers don't even require additional sugar to reach their minimum level of carbonation. Just time.
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Old 08-12-2010, 08:31 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by MBasile View Post
If the bottles taste sweeter than the hydrometer samples and there is no yeast residue, I'd say you had very little yeast in suspension and it is taking those remaining yeasties quite a long time to get through the priming sugar.
thanks MBasile, but I just can't believe this could be the case. Bear in mind, beer was in combination of primary and secondary for only a fortnight AND because it was looking/tasting so promising i did not fine in advance of bottling. So prima facie, there simply must be yeast available no?
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Old 08-12-2010, 08:37 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revvy View Post
There's really nothing wrong with your beer, except that you opened them too soon, they're not ready yet.

The 3 weeks at 70 degrees, that that we recommend is the minimum time it takes for average gravity beers to carbonate and condition. Higher grav beers take longer.

Stouts and porters have taken me between 6 and 8 weeks to carb up..I have a 1.090 Belgian strong that took three months to carb up.

Temp and gravity are the two factors that contribute to the time it takes to carb beer. But if a beer's not ready yet, or seems low carbed, and you added the right amount of sugar to it, then it's not stalled, it's just not time yet.

Everything you need to know about carbing and conditioning, can be found here Of Patience and Bottle Conditioning. With emphasis on the word, "patience."

The other factor is that you are using 16 ouncers, and that adds more time to the necessary wait period. I have some pints, 22 oz bombers and other sizes that I often use, but since I enter contests I usually also do a sixer or two of standard 12 ouncers for entering. And inevitably the 12 ouncers are done at least a week faster than the larger bottles....some times two weeks ahead of time...

Also the rule of thumb is 3 weeks at 70 degrees for a normal grav 12 ounce bottle....to carb and condition....It takes longer for the yeasties to convert the larger volume in the bigger bottles to enough co2 in the headspace to be reabsorbed back into the solution...A ration I don't know how much...

Big Kahuna gives a good explanation here...


Really just give your beer a couple more weeks, and they should be fine. By doing the prime tabs, you pretty much gaurenteed yourself that you did it right. You added the same amount of sugar to each bottle. That makes it pretty foolproof, which means, barring any bad seal on those grolsh bottles, they will carb up eventually.


If a beer isn't carbed by "x number of weeks" you just have to give them ore time. If you added your sugar, then the beer will carb up eventually, it's really a foolroof process. All beers will carb up eventually. A lot of new brewers think they have to "troubleshoot" a bottling issue, when there really is none, the beer knows how to carb itself. In fact if you run beersmiths carbing calculator, some lower grav beers don't even require additional sugar to reach their minimum level of carbonation. Just time.
Revvy, thanks for the comprehensive response. You had me at "Hello"
I'm going to follow your suggestion and leave for another few weeks. It sounds like the quick/early carbonation I've achieved on the batches done to date using the same bottles, carbonation tab doses etc might be the exception rather than the rule?
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Old 08-13-2010, 03:29 AM   #16
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I have had a Belgium Tripel IPA take up to 4 months to carbonate. Even still after 5 months, every 4th or 5th beer is flat while the other are perfect!

Lesson I learned.. Use a starter to promote healthier yeast at bottle time!

Also, some other advice, let these sit and start brewing another batch to take your mind off them. check them back out in a few weeks.

let us know how it turns out!

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Old 08-26-2010, 11:08 PM   #17
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to bring some closure to this thread (and in the interest of putting a very smug smile on Revvys dial) I opened a couple of bottles of the zero-carbonation at 2 weeks batch and pop! Carbonation I would describe as absolutely perfect. I have learned a valuable lesson
thanks again for the feedback

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