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Old 03-08-2013, 01:39 AM   #1
eric19312
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Over the past few months I've seen many many threads cautioning new brewers about the need for patience both in fermentation and bottling. 3 weeks in primary, minimum, longer for big beers, 3 weeks in bottle at room temp, minimum forager age strength beer, maybe significantly longer for big beers, then a week or so in the fridge, then it's ready to drink...

I've been following this advice and have seen the quality of my beers improve almost every batch better than the last in some way.



So here is my question...what are you doing with double IPAs? Some of these recipes have close to $30 worth of hops in 5 gal batch...mostly flavor and aroma additions. They fade fast and need to be consumed young. How do you balance getting clean fermentation and full carb with need to drink them young?


Too bad cant figure out how to edit thread title...

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Old 03-08-2013, 02:30 AM   #2
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Here's what I do with my 5.5 gallon IPA's and IIPA's.

First, I make sure I have a healthy dose of late addition hops. That means 4 or more ounces somewhere in the last ten minutes of the boil and flame out. I cool to the recommended fermentation temperature range and pitch a healthy yeast count of a clean American ale yeast. This could either be a large starter or the correct amount of rehydrated dry yeast, according to calculations on MrMalty. Fermentation is always quick to start and quick to end as long as I have a good pitch rate and good temperature control, even with high OG beers. I've gone from 1.079 to 1.09 in about 7 days.

As soon as I get stable gravity readings over a couple days, I dry hop with 4 or more ounces per 5.5 gallon batch. This lasts anywhere from 5 to 10 days. I then cold crash and hold the temp at around 32F for 2-5 days. I then add gelatin to quickly clear the beer, which is sometimes overnight and sometimes after 48 hours. I then bottle with priming sugar and keep at or above 68F. (EDIT: I should add that I also use irish moss or whirfloc and hold a good rolling boil on that end of the process, then I use the gelatin at the other end. This ensures that I quickly get a nice clear beer that won't need extended conditioning to have everything settle out of it. In other words, I'm doing what I can to speed up the process and preserve as much of the hop aroma and flavor as possible. Yes, I may loose some to the gelatin, but I just add more hops to the next batch if I notice it needs it.)

After two weeks it's carbonated, but the hop bitterness, flavor, and aroma seem to still be melding at that point. After 3 weeks they are great and the flavor and bitterness are pretty stable. I've never had an IPA batch last me more than 3 months, so I can't say what happens after that, but up to that point, it's really just the aroma that I notice will fade, but not to the point that I care much about it. It still has a nice bouquet.

Big beers don't necessarily mean long primary or long conditioning for me. If I control my pitch rate for the OG, stay in the recommended fermentation temperature range of the yeast, and do what I can to quickly drop the yeast, proteins, and other particles in the beer, there's no reason I need a long fermentation or condition in an IPA. My malt centered beers like brown ales and stouts on the other hand, do benefit greatly from longer conditioning.

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Old 03-08-2013, 04:24 AM   #3
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We just finished off a bottle of our 10.5 % ABV DIPA which had 18 oz of hops and was brewed om Feb 4th, bottled on Feb 22, and drank today. Tasted great but will be better in a week or two, peak in 3-4 weeks, and start to lose hop aroma thereafter... but still taste great for up to a year or so...

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Old 03-08-2013, 02:48 PM   #4
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I'm currently enjoying a Stone Ruination clone (extract recipe from BYO) with an OG 1.072 that I brewed just under four weeks ago, and it's fantastic!

I used Wyeast 1968 (London ESB), which is a very fast fermentor and cleans up quickly. After aerating with pure O2 and pitching an appropriately sized yeast starter, it hit FG in one week. I made sure it was stable for three days, then dry hopped in the primary for 4 days using whole hops in a bag, then bottled right at the two week mark.

After only a week and a half in bottle they pour a large head (meaning they need more time, obviously), but it is by far the best beer I have ready at the moment. My English IPA that was in primary for four weeks and has been bottled for six weeks is undrinkable compared to the Ruination clone, and the clone is way better than my Hop Head Double IPA that was in primary for four weeks and has been in bottles for another four. The earlier two batches just aren't ready yet.

The difference between the batches that aren't ready yet, and the one with the quick turnaround time, is all yeast related.

Fermentation temps, pitching rate, and proper aeration make a huge difference.

BTW - the Ruination Double IPA is a very heavy hop hitter, and there's only 6-7oz (depending on alpha acid %) of hops in it, including dry hopping. What recipe are you looking at that has $30 worth of hops in it?

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Old 03-08-2013, 04:30 PM   #5
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This is a good discussion

From my perspective the issue here is nose/hop aroma, and we all know fresh is best. Julioardz has some great tips & I think is spot on.

Unfortunately for us bottlers I think we are SOL. The additional 2-3 weeks to carb is a killer. The commercial/keg guys get to force carb (and keep it cold from crash to glass) which is the ideal practice for the style. I don't know what the answer is...perhaps over compensate late/dry hops to account for losses? It'd be good to know

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Old 03-08-2013, 06:15 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VampireSix

BTW - the Ruination Double IPA is a very heavy hop hitter, and there's only 6-7oz (depending on alpha acid %) of hops in it, including dry hopping. What recipe are you looking at that has $30 worth of hops in it?

Wookey Jack

4.75 oz Amarillo
4.75 oz citra
0.5 oz magnum

Zombie dust clone 8.5 oz citra

Pliny the elder...about a pound of hops including simcoe, centenial, columbus and chinook

Your mileage may vary... Am sure you can get these hops for something less than $30 by buying in bulk but these are the sort of beers I was thinking about when I posted the thread.
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Old 03-08-2013, 06:17 PM   #7
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I don't find aroma dissipates as much in bottled beer (or other wise unopened, un-off-gassed packaging such as keeping a keg untapped for months) as I do with a keg that I'm actively drinking or that spent a long time cold crashing, etc. The aroma escapes in the off-gas, which only happens when you open the beer (or serve from the keg, which pushes some gas out with it.)

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Old 03-11-2013, 10:39 AM   #8
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I am a hop head and go crazy with late additions, flameout and dry hopping but I find that the flavor/aroma stays for easily 2-3 months before it fades (from bottling day)

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Old 03-11-2013, 11:22 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calichusetts View Post
I am a hop head and go crazy with late additions, flameout and dry hopping but I find that the flavor/aroma stays for easily 2-3 months before it fades (from bottling day)
I agree, my ipas stay fresh for a good 2 months after bottling. They would last longer if i had more fridge space. Drinking them young is relative to beers that can age for many months and improve or at least not deteriorate.
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:43 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tre9er View Post
The aroma escapes in the off-gas, which only happens when you open the beer (or serve from the keg, which pushes some gas out with it.)
Not from my experience. For me, older bottles, homebrew or commericial, wll loose hop aroma and flavor with time.




edit to say:
. . . but you do have a point.
Where does it go if the bottle is sealed?
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