Auto siphon w/hop sock = Lots of Air!! - Page 2

Calichusetts · 02-06-2012, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smizak

I also tried a nylon hop bag or the Autosiphon tip on my first dry-hopped beer. Disaster, lost over a gallon of beer.

What I do know is 1.) Only dryhop with pellets 2.) Zip tie a sanitized nylon hop bag over the end of the hose in the bottling bucket. I lightly cinch a stainless 1/2" clamp just on the end to have something to hold the bag on. Leave plenty of bag free after the hose end, tie it just at the top of the bag. Works awesome along with careful racking, catches any free straggling hop pieces that make their way into the siphon.

I tried this but there was so much hop debris coming through into the bag that it was impossible to get a nice whirlpool and mix the priming solution with the beer...I got three left and have only had one that was not carbed but it didn't even do that good of a job, LOTS of hop particles in the beer. It took over a week in the fridge and a flawless pour (leaving about 25% in the bottle) to get a clear beer.

I am going to try it over the siphoning end but I am also going to dry hop in a bag from now on.

**Revvy** · 02-06-2012, 10:54 AM

Why is it the whenever someone sees a bubble in an autosiphon line, do they assume it is oxygen and NOT co2? Did you repeatedly lift the bottom of the autosiphon above the liquid line while it was flowing? If you kept it in the beer, then what was being disgorged out of solution was MORE LIKELY co2.

Bubbles forming doesn't necesaary equate with AIR BUBBLES forming, unless you actually introduced air into the intake at the bottom of the autosiphon, there should be no air actually in the fluid.

**Burgs** · 02-06-2012, 11:59 AM

I screwed this up about as badly as one could trying to siphon through a hop sock and the beer tasted great in the end, so I wouldn't worry about this one little step ruining anything.

I think the problem with the hop socks is that they're so flimsy, they get saturated and just cling to the sides of the autosiphon. I can see how strainer bags would be better for this purpose.

**Bobby_M** · 02-06-2012, 01:16 PM

If you want to test if it's really air leaking in from the seal between the larger and smaller tubing, just pour a small amount of bottled water down the larger tube. That would make it impossible for air to leak through the seal. If you still have bubbles forming, check the seal between your hose and racking cane. The added resistance of the filter bag could pull air there. If the bubbles are for sure not coming from there, then it's CO2 coming out of solution due to the pressure drop on the carboy side of the siphon.

**greenbirds** · 02-06-2012, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby_M

If you want to test if it's really air leaking in from the seal between the larger and smaller tubing, just pour a small amount of bottled water down the larger tube. That would make it impossible for air to leak through the seal. If you still have bubbles forming, check the seal between your hose and racking cane. The added resistance of the filter bag could pull air there. If the bubbles are for sure not coming from there, then it's CO2 coming out of solution due to the pressure drop on the carboy side of the siphon.

Great idea to test that theory.

jeburgdo · 02-06-2012, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revvy

Why is it the whenever someone sees a bubble in an autosiphon line, do they assume it is oxygen and NOT co2? Did you repeatedly lift the bottom of the autosiphon above the liquid line while it was flowing? If you kept it in the beer, then what was being disgorged out of solution was MORE LIKELY co2.

Bubbles forming doesn't necesaary equate with AIR BUBBLES forming, unless you actually introduced air into the intake at the bottom of the autosiphon, there should be no air actually in the fluid.

I suppose I mis-spoke. I actually wasn't sure if they were air bubbles or not, but I think I have reasons to believe they were not CO2 bubbles. This was the second time I racked the beer, and the first time, no CO2. It has been about 4 weeks since brew day, and I've never had bubbles form like this any other time I've moved beers around. The one time I had CO2 was with apfelwein, and they were much smaller and fizzy, unlike these bubbles. The only difference in method I can account for is dry-hopping and using a hop bag to strain.

Further, if I gave the auto-siphon a couple of pumps, for whatever reason, it would pump clear of bubbles for several seconds. My guess was that this was either cavitation somehow caused by the hop bag or air being sucked in from a loose seal with the siphon rod (the hose was fine).

Since I did not know the reason, or do any tests with water and hop bags after I racked the beer (perhaps I should have), I figured I'd ask to see if anyone had any experience with this phenomenon and what the results were. I will test the seal between the large ans small tubes later tonight via the method described above.

**greenbirds** · 02-16-2012, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeburgdo

...I will test the seal between the large ans small tubes later tonight via the method described above.

Any results?

jeburgdo · 02-16-2012, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenbirds

Any results?

Oh yeah, forgot to report back.

I did try it out with just water, and whether or not I had water poured into the larger tube, no bubbles formed. Seems like my racking cane is ok...

I've used the cane again for beer (no bubbling), and noticed that if there's any leaking at the small/large tube contact, it allows a small amount of beer (enough to create a seal) UP into the large tube rather than air in.

Haven't tried the beer since bottling, so no word on whether it is cardboard or not, but it seems that since the phenomenon I experience had bubbles forming at the base, it is at least consistent with cavitation, but I'm not so convinced. It just seems strange, and it doesn't help this is something I know almost nothing about.

**DeafSmith** · 02-16-2012, 07:24 PM

I have had the same problem with a bag on the end of the autosiphon clogging, so I changed my method - now if I am racking to a bottling bucket, I line the bucket with a jumbo size grain bag (got mine from AHS), fold the excess over the top and secure it with a bungee cord around the outside of the bottling bucket (I boil the bag to sanitize it). After racking into the bucket, I just lift the bag out and the hop pellet residue is contained in the bag. If I am racking to a keg (my usual practice now), I cold crash first and everything settles to the bottom.

A couple of things I have found helpful when using autosiphons:
* Clean the autosiphon immediately after use and store the parts separately to prevent the gasket on the cane from becoming deformed
* I use 3/8 inch ID silicone hose on my 1/2 inch autosiphon - it works much better than vinyl - easy to get on and off and forms an airtight seal with no hose clamp needed - plus it can be sanitized by boiling.

GMP428 · 02-22-2012, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby_M

If you want to test if it's really air leaking in from the seal between the larger and smaller tubing, just pour a small amount of bottled water down the larger tube. That would make it impossible for air to leak through the seal. If you still have bubbles forming, check the seal between your hose and racking cane. The added resistance of the filter bag could pull air there. If the bubbles are for sure not coming from there, then it's CO2 coming out of solution due to the pressure drop on the carboy side of the siphon.

bobby_m is right. the majority of your problems are coming from air flowing around the gasket of the smaller tube of your autosiphon. the way to fix this while racking is to pour some wort down the larger tube. that way wort, rather than air is flowing around the gasket and up your racking cane. you might have to refill the larger tube a couple of times because it will eventually suck all the wort down and begin to start sucking air again.