CvilleKevin

Recipes 

Last night, while watching the last game of the World Series with a buddy, we checked out the results of last years clarifier experiments.

Most of the batches had gone to vinegar - it was late in the season when I did these, and I let them sit around a little too long before bottling. The exception was the batch that I cleared with super-klear - it cleared so fast that I bottled it before the others and it had no vinegar taste. It was a little dry, but nice clean and refreshing. The batches that I added pectic enzyme to before pitching yeast had a little less vinegar, but that was because they cleared faster and were bottled earlier than the batches without the enzyme in the beginning. Other than the vinegar, none of the batches tasted off, but that was a pretty major flaw.

So bottom line, I botched the clarifier experiments by letting them sit around for too long before bottle. The super kleer still managed to come out OK.

last year was the second year that I didnt use k-meta for any of the batches, and while they were all drinkable earlier, there was an effect on storage - I had a few kegs that went to vinegar over the summer. One thing I noticed is that before picking up the vinegar taste, the kegs that turned picked up a malic acid taste that wasnt bad at first, but kept building until too strong, then turned to vinegar. Its normal for the ciders to finish with a malic acid bite that mellows after a few months, but in this case the malic acid taste was increasing in time instead of decreasing. This season I'm going to continue to skip the k-meta before pitching, but if any of the kegs pick up a malic acid taste in the spring, I'll add some k-meta then.

HappyWino

Recipes 

This is my first attempt to make a cider in the style of Crispin's "The Saint", using the methods that have been kindly refined and documented on this thread It is also my first attempt at cider from freshly pressed juice.

I made my batch from ~5.5g fresh pressed, un-pasteurized juice (50% Granny Smith and 50% mixed apples), 12oz of Maple syrup and about 20oz of dextrose. I created a starter with some apple juice, Fermaid-k, and WPL500 yeast. Pitched it at ~72 degrees and fermentation was going strong 12 hours later.

After 4-5 days (don't have my notes handy) I checked the OG and it was down to 1008, lower than I intended and therefore with much less apple flavor and sweetness than I intended. I still had close to a gallon of the original apple juice left so I simply added it back in to 1014 and cold crashed it. This got plenty of apple taste back in there but it was still very thin tasting.

It's still sitting in the fridge crashing but the thin although apply taste has me worried, is that par for the course right after primary fermentation and if so, how much aging have people found necessary to overcome it?

I made a batch of EdWorts Apfelwein last year it it was incredibly thin, a year later and it is a lot better, it wasn't my plan to age this for a month, never mind a year

Cheers

HW

CvilleKevin

Recipes 

My experience is that a lot of the body, and some sweetness also, will come back after crashing in the fridge for a couple days. It will be even better when its carbed. I'm not sure why this is. Sometimes the cider will still have some rough edges for a while, particularly if there is a lot of tannin and/or acid. This may take a week or two to settle out. If you go dry, the resulting acids can take some time to mellow, but if you stopped it when the normal ferment was 1.008 and then added juice, this should not be a problem. k-meta can also leave a harsh taste that can take a couple months to mellow. YMMV.

Accidic

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I occasionally get what I call wet trashcan bottom notes that go away given enough time. Is there a way around this?

CvilleKevin

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Not sure what you mean by wet trashcan. wet cardboard? thats from oxidation.

Accidic

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It's not the oxidation taste as I screwed up one before. I'm afraid it's too hot for the yeast but I'm not having the same issue with beer. I have been using cane as I can't find corn sugar around here also. I've got a second one running at 66 tho. Plus age seems to beat that taste down somewhat.

CvilleKevin

Recipes 

can you describe the taste then? Not sure what you mean by 'wet trashcan'. I doubt its the sugar. what juice and yeast are you using?

Accidic

Recipes 

Tastes like the smell in the bottom of a trash can when you go to wash it out is the best description but alternatively I would say the tang of sour milk with the flavor of licorice added.

Pasteurized but unfiltered gala. Montracet (which may have been somewhat old as I screwed up my rotation in the move) yeast.

CvilleKevin

Recipes 

I dont believe I've ever run into anything like that before. perhaps some sort of infection due to low acidity? galas make a great flavor/aroma apple, but dont have much acidity. They are good mixed with some tart apples (granny smith, york, winesap, etc) and something a little heavier to hold down the bottom, but I doubt they would make a good single varietal.

CidahMastah

Recipes 

Accidic - http://morebeer.com/content/homebrew-off-flavors

Check that out. Sounds like you could have a couple things going on. That is beer specific but you might be able to pick out a few of the things that might be at play based on your situation.

Montrachet is known to produce a fair amount of sulfur, so that might be part of it.

It sounds like you might have had a bacterial thing, or wrong wild yeast fermenting thing. Did you sulphite your cider 24hrs before pitching? ? did you put yeast nutrient in your must? What were the conditions of your ferment, yeast stressing a lot due to temp, nutrient, etc.?

Ask yourself a few questions and I think you will come up with your answer. I haven't used Montrachet on cider because I have heard a lot of people complain about sulfur. But I have never had those kind of smells in a cider.

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