Cold crash and Carbonation

speakspress · 01-02-2011, 06:42 PM

I have a three gallon batch of a very simple cider I would like to hard crash to clarify and bottle condition.

After a cold crash and the edition of a primer is there still enough yeast is suspension to obtain carbonation? Or is it best to skip the cold crash?

My objective is to clear the cider naturally and quickly but still achieve carbonation within a reasonable time frame.

Thanks for the help.

speakspress · 01-03-2011, 08:32 PM

Anyone have any suggestions?

GinKings · 01-03-2011, 08:45 PM

Cold crashing is typically done to stop fermentation prematurely in order to retain some sweetness. Warm it back up without adding sulfites and sorbate and fermentation will probably restart. This doesn't work very well when you want to carbonate in the bottle. Renewed fermentation in the bottle of a partially fermented cider could create bottle bombs. Adding sulfites/sorbate will eliminate the possibility of carbonation in the bottle.

Putting the cider in the fridge after fermentation ends should speed clarification up a bit. There still should be some yeast in suspension for bottle carbonation, but I typically add a little to the bottling bucket to make sure.

Calder · 01-03-2011, 10:49 PM

If you started with a cloudy juice, you might try Pectic Enzyme, or use Gelatin and cold crash.

Yes, there will still be plenty of yeast available for carbonation.

As the previous poster indicated, if you haven't fermented out completely, you will have extra residual sugars and potential for over-carbonation.

speakspress · 01-03-2011, 11:59 PM

I am fermenting this batch all the way out. The cold crash is for clarification. I have done it before for a still cider and it cleared up very quick. Now I am just trying to bottle condition the same recipe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GinKings

Putting the cider in the fridge after fermentation ends should speed clarification up a bit. There still should be some yeast in suspension for bottle carbonation, but I typically add a little to the bottling bucket to make sure.

Interesting idea. How much do you add for a 5 gallon batch?

mrouzan · 01-04-2011, 01:22 AM

I believe you may be confused. Cold crashing is used to kill all yeast and stop your SG at your desired sweetness. If you want a sweet cider and want to bottle prime, you have to ferment to dry and then back sweeten with a nonfermentable sugar i.e. Splenda, Lactose, Truvia. Other wise when your SG gets to 1004-1002 you can bottle it right away and the residual yeast will eat the sugar and carb your bottle. To clearify cider, most people add a pectin enzyme prior to fermentation.

**Revvy** · 01-04-2011, 01:39 AM

Cold crashing is NOT to kill your yeast, your yeast doesn't die, it simply goes dormant and floculates out of solution.....

But in order to get the yeast active to carbonate the beer,cider, it must be above 70 degrees. When you rack to your bottling bucket you make sure to bring some of the DORMANT NOT DEAD yeast from the bottom of the previous vessl, which will then wake up once you let the beer or cider warm up before you prime with sugar. Or you calculate the less amount of sugar you need if you are leaving it cold when you bottle, but they will wake up from their SLEEP not DEATH, to carbonate.

If you are trying to slow down fermentation to a certain level of sweetness by using the cold TO PUT THE YEAST TO SLEEP NOT KILL THEM, you must keep whatever your are doing that to cold at all times, because as soon as it warms up the yeast will WAKE UP (NOT FROM THE DEAD LIKE A MICROBIAL ZOMBIE) and begin to ferment again.

But you cannot naturally carb that way, you can't have your cake and eat it to that way. If you are truly wanting to stop fermentation at a certain level of sweetness, they you will have to KILL the yeast off first, NOT PUT IT TO SLEEP, through pasturization or chemical means, but then if you want to naturally carb it, you will have to add a tiny bit of fresh yeast along with your priming sugar, just enough to consume the priming sugar. But it will be touchy if you haven't truly let the beer or cider finish fermenting, becuase the yeast will want to eat ANY unfermented sugars floating around, and you could have bottle bombs.

Capice?

speakspress · 01-04-2011, 02:27 AM

Capice.

Again, I like the idea of adding a "tiny" bit of fresh yeast to the bottling bucket. But, how much is tiny? For 5 gallons - 1 gram? Less?

Calder · 01-04-2011, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revvy

If you are truly wanting to stop fermentation at a certain level of sweetness, they you will have to KILL the yeast off first, NOT PUT IT TO SLEEP, through pasturization or chemical means, but then if you want to naturally carb it, you will have to add a tiny bit of fresh yeast along with your priming sugar, just enough to consume the priming sugar. But it will be touchy if you haven't truly let the beer or cider finish fermenting, becuase the yeast will want to eat ANY unfermented sugars floating around, and you could have bottle bombs.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that if you use sorbate or other chemical, it will just kill off any new yeast you add to it. And if you heat pasturize, the new yeast WILL eat all the unfermented sugars, giving you gushers or possibly bombs.

**Revvy** · 01-04-2011, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calder

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that if you use sorbate or other chemical, it will just kill off any new yeast you add to it. And if you heat pasturize, the new yeast WILL eat all the unfermented sugars, giving you gushers or possibly bombs.

I didn't think about the effect of the sorbate on the NEW yeast, but I think you are right, it would also more than likely kill the yeast you added after.

And as to pasturization, then adding yeast, that's the sticky wicket the yeast is going to cobble up the unfermentable sugars left over as well as the new sugar. I don't know if a couple of grains of yeast can potentially gobble up all the sugar. But that's why I personally wouldn't mess with this crap...I would just let the yeast finish fermenting the cider or beer or whatever, then like we do with beer, carbonate at will. Back sweeten with lactose or splenda if you have to but then add the right amount of sugar to carb.

I really only jumped in because people kept saying that cold crashing killed the yeast and we know it doesn't.