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mlee0000 09-18-2007 07:35 PM

Cider Question (adding sugar)
 
I'm doing 5 gallons of cider (using organic apple juice and wine yeast). I mixed the recommended amount of yeast nutrient in with the juice, added the yeast, and aerated.

I held off on adding any further sugar to the mix because the juice was already at 1.053, and I didn't want it to take forever to start fermenting.

My question is: when is the best time to add the sugar? (I'm using corn syrup) Should I wait until I see the first signs of fermentation, during peak krausen, or when it starts to die down?

I know that the yeast prefer to eat the glucose (dextrose) first, and then move on to the fructose. I also know that the corn syrup contains a decent amount of dextrose (which is corn sugar), but it also says it contains high fructose corn syrup (I don't know how much of each it contains).

mgayer 09-19-2007 12:05 PM

The best time to add sugars are at the start! Your gravity reading is not even close to overpowering the yeast. If you had over a 1.30 then you may want to keep a careful eye on it but your fine. If you wait to add sugars what happens is step additions, and it creates higher ABV %. I do this with meads that use yeasts that do not go above 14% normally, I can get them in the 16% to 17.5% range by doing it that way. I pitched 4 1 gallon batches, see my Cider Yeast test, and the SG was a bit higher and I used Ale and Lager yeast.

Get the sugar in as fast as possible and the must can be stirred for the few few days so you can mix the syrup so it won't all just fall to the bottom. I would suggest next time to pour above half the juice out of a jug and add the sugar to the jug and shake it until it is mixed well. This also helps to put some O2 in the must.

mlee0000 09-20-2007 03:34 AM

You're saying that yeast can survive in a gravity of 1.300? If that even fermented out, you would have an ABV of 38.66%.

The specific gravity of straight corn syrup is about 1.420.

I'm thinking maybe we're using different units or something.

I might just leave this batch alone. With an OG of 1.053 with just the apple juice, I'll end up at around 5-6% ABV (I've never used this yeast before, so I don't know about its attenuation).

Heck, if I go any higher than that, I'm liable to get in trouble. :tank:

mrk305 09-20-2007 03:58 AM

Read the Edwort's appfelwies thread. Thousands of gallons made this year by members of this forum. You won't get krausen like you get in beer. Just lots of little bubbles. Add 2 pounds of corn sugar in the beginning and wait 1 month. Then you can carb with either more apple juice (tried that) priming sugar (tried that) or honey (trying that now). Of course you don't have to carbonate either. Some people are adding artificial sweetners to it because it is kind of dry and tangy, but I like it like it is. You can also mix it with sprite, cranberry juice, etc. Look for Edworts post. It is probably the biggest post on homebrewtalk. Like he says, start another batch in two weeks.

mgayer 09-20-2007 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlee0000
You're saying that yeast can survive in a gravity of 1.300? If that even fermented out, you would have an ABV of 38.66%.

The specific gravity of straight corn syrup is about 1.420.

I'm thinking maybe we're using different units or something.

I might just leave this batch alone. With an OG of 1.053 with just the apple juice, I'll end up at around 5-6% ABV (I've never used this yeast before, so I don't know about its attenuation).

Heck, if I go any higher than that, I'm liable to get in trouble. :tank:

Yes I am! And there is not a yeast that can survive an ABV that high, but I have got it to 21%! Your corn syrup gravity is about right, the same with honey. I have being making meads for just a few years now and I do it all the time(Cysers are Apple juice and Honey, a very high SG). The point here is get the sugars you want in at the begining and use you hydrometer. If you have a triple scale you can see about what your ABV will be. Ciders and beers range from 3.5 to about 9 or 10 ABV. Anything above that is really considered wine. Once you get comfortable with making a few different flavor and yeast experiment in the direction of flavors you enjoy the most. Me, I like to keep about 4 kinds going. Of course so do my friends!:mug:

david_42 09-20-2007 03:38 PM

I prefer straight juice for cider. 5-6% is plenty if you are planning on a couple pints. I've had good luck adding sugars (for other people) at the beginning of the ferment and after a couple days. A wine yeast won't have trouble either way.


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