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Old 01-06-2013, 06:23 AM   #1
Bluespark
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Default Welches concord pyment

Anyone ever made this?

I love Concord grape, had 3 extra # of honey and the juice was on sale, not from concentrate, no additives . I decided to do an experiment.

3 lb honey
2 x 1.36 litre bottles of Welches Concord grape juice
Energizer and nutrient
Water to make a gallon,
kv1116.

My SG was way higher than I expected, at 1.130. I had intended somewhere around 1.1. Oops. Hopefully it gets going ok.

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Old 01-06-2013, 09:25 AM   #2
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Ah, well that sort of looks a bit like what I made last september.

The only difference being that I have 18 gallons (imperial not US gallons) or so and I used fresh wine grapes (shiraz/syrah, merlot and tempranillo).

I started with just the crushed grape and added 1.5kg of honey per bucket (4 x 27 litre buckets). Letting it ferment some (daily punch down of cap etc) then adding 500g (I think) on each step feed. I added extra honey, 3 times I think it was. Then let it finish.

At pressing the gravities varied from 1.020 to 1.004, then left it under airlock in carboys to finish (hopefully) and drop a sediment.

Since then its been reduced by racking off the sediment and is now sitting in carboys with 1 medium toasted oak stave per US gallon.

Now the difference being that if you tried making a red wine with eating grapes, you often get what's termed a "foxy" after taste. I can't explain that so you'd have to google for a more definite description of what to look for when its done......it may be that the honey notes will cover that.

Also putting all the sugars in up front might make for a few fermentation issues toward the end and while in theory the yeast will hit 18% ABV in practice, it might not get quite that far (18% equates to a gravity drop of 133 points).

Don't recall any mention of nutrients ? It'd probably be wise to have some in the batch, even if its just boiled bread yeast.

Also you won't get it looking like a red wine, more like a rose as you haven't got any skins in the brew. Some of the colour will get bleached by primary.

Either way, if it gets too 1.020 or less it'll be looking good.

I'd still suggest you manage your batch with daily aeration down to the 1/3rd sugar break (about 1.085 or so) before airlocking to finish.

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Old 01-06-2013, 03:13 PM   #3
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I actually just started a pyment last night. Had 1.5 gallons of Newman's Own 100% Grape Juice on hand, though I used a combo of honey and sugar to reach OG of 1.120, SG of the juice was 1.060. Will use staggered nutrient dosing. Pitching WhiteLabs Sweet Mead yeast. Really should grab another two pack of bottles from Costco and turn this into three gallons.

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Old 01-06-2013, 04:05 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by saramc View Post
I actually just started a pyment last night. Had 1.5 gallons of Newman's Own 100% Grape Juice on hand, though I used a combo of honey and sugar to reach OG of 1.120, SG of the juice was 1.060. Will use staggered nutrient dosing. Pitching WhiteLabs Sweet Mead yeast. Really should grab another two pack of bottles from Costco and turn this into three gallons.
Well, from memory, the White Labs sweet mead yeast has a much better rep than the wyeast one of the same name (not that I'm a believer in any so called "mead yeast" sweet or dry......how the hell do the makers know what yeasts were historically used when it was Pasteur who understood fermentation first, and there's no historic detail about which yeasts might have been used in the dark ages). In any case, it's not down to the yeast, it's down to the maker whether it's sweet or dry......

I seem to recall that the WL sweet one will do 15% ABV, and if you managed to drop the gravity too 1.000 you'd have 16.3% ABV, so if you get it down to something like 1.010 you'd have some residual sugars in the brew and it'd be sort of "medium".......
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:41 PM   #5
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Since then its been reduced by racking off the sediment and is now sitting in carboys with 1 medium toasted oak stave per US gallon.
How big are your oak staves? 1 stave/gallon, I might have to put some more in our meads! Our staves will fit in a 5 gallon but we have to break them to get into a 3 gallon carboy. WVMJ
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:06 PM   #6
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How big are your oak staves? 1 stave/gallon, I might have to put some more in our meads! Our staves will fit in a 5 gallon but we have to break them to get into a 3 gallon carboy. WVMJ
First attempt at oaking anything, so they're about 6 inches long and 1/4 inch square.

I'll put more in later on this week......
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:41 PM   #7
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I seem to recall that the WL sweet one will do 15% ABV, and if you managed to drop the gravity too 1.000 you'd have 16.3% ABV, so if you get it down to something like 1.010 you'd have some residual sugars in the brew and it'd be sort of "medium".......
Yes, I am hoping for a natural residual sugar, if not I will use 4-6oz honey per gallon during backsweetening. Nothing but time.
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:14 AM   #8
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FB, you cant call them staves, those are pencils The ones we have are about 20 inches long and 3/4 inch wide, if you put that many of thse in your wine I would have predicted you might not oak anything anymore I really like the oak in our melomels, its way in the background of the taste, someone who doesnt like oak wines complains, people that like oak in wines hardly notices it. We are working on our first trad right now, of course its oaked, not a lot but just enough I hope.

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First attempt at oaking anything, so they're about 6 inches long and 1/4 inch square.

I'll put more in later on this week......
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:19 PM   #9
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When I got it (the oak) it was basically the dimensions you mention, but by the time I'd planed off the inner charring and outer dirt etc it made sense to slit it down to small pieces to toast off quicker and allow me to be cautious with how much I start with.

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Old 01-10-2013, 02:57 PM   #10
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Update: Bubbling away nicely, smells fantastic.

all this talk of oaking got me thinking, how should I finish this one? I typically like wine, especially red(this doesnt count as a red wine, but its the closest comparison I have at the moment) on the dryer side. Not sure If I should have this finish dry or semi sweet? and should I oak it? if I do this would be my first oak experiment. Oak and concord grape sounds good in theory....

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