Get your HBT Growlers, Shirts and Membership before the Rush!


Home Brew Forums > Wine, Mead, Cider, Sake & Soda > Mead Forum > Using real pressed cider for cyser
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-27-2012, 01:39 PM   #1
centworthy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 31
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Default Using real pressed cider for cyser

In September I started a cyser with the real deal fresh, pressed apple cider with no preservatives or additives. You know, the stuff you find at apple farms that is thick, caramel colored and not the clear stuff you find in the grocery store. Has anyone ever done a cyser with this kind of cider? If so, does it ever clear or will it stay opaque? It tastes good so far, no issues just wondering how long this one will take and if I should expect it to clear.

__________________
centworthy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-27-2012, 05:15 PM   #2
fatbloke
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: UK - South Coast.
Posts: 2,682
Liked 174 Times on 161 Posts
Likes Given: 26

Default

Well apart from the semantics of language (cider is fermented apple juice just about everywhere except the US, where its hard cider), the cloudiness in your cyser could be from the original apple juice or from the honey, or even still some yeast in suspension.

The 3 to 4 months period since you started this is still quite a short time.

Have you checked to make sure that the ferment is complete ? (3 identical gravity measurements, each reading taken 2 or 3 days apart with no change).

If the ferment is finished have you racked it off the sediment ?

If you're feeling a bit impatient to get stuck in, and as long as the ferment is completed etc then you could hit it with some finings. I'd say that you should start off trying something gentle like bentonite or sparkoloid. If they don't sort it then there's always the kiesol and chitosan 2 part finings that clear stuff a lot quicker.

What ever you decide to do or try you will still need to rack off of any sediments that form......

__________________

"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away". Tom Waits.

Oh, and here's some blog stuff!

fatbloke is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-27-2012, 11:58 PM   #3
centworthy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 31
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbloke
Well apart from the semantics of language (cider is fermented apple juice just about everywhere except the US, where its hard cider), the cloudiness in your cyser could be from the original apple juice or from the honey, or even still some yeast in suspension.

The 3 to 4 months period since you started this is still quite a short time.

Have you checked to make sure that the ferment is complete ? (3 identical gravity measurements, each reading taken 2 or 3 days apart with no change).

If the ferment is finished have you racked it off the sediment ?

If you're feeling a bit impatient to get stuck in, and as long as the ferment is completed etc then you could hit it with some finings. I'd say that you should start off trying something gentle like bentonite or sparkoloid. If they don't sort it then there's always the kiesol and chitosan 2 part finings that clear stuff a lot quicker.

What ever you decide to do or try you will still need to rack off of any sediments that form......
I racked it off the primary a month ago. The cider itself ( before adding to the primary) was dense and not clear like apple juice typically is, it is still just as cloudy as it started out although a lot of the apple bits look like they have fallen to the bottom in the secondary so I plan to rack again soon. I was just wondering if I can expect all of the apple bits to fall into the sediment over time or if it will never totally clear. To your point I suppose time will tell.
__________________
centworthy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 12:03 AM   #4
saramc
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: suburb of Louisville, KY
Posts: 1,743
Liked 147 Times on 133 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Did you dose it well with pectinase? Fresh pressed cider will clear if you remembered to use enzyme. You can always opt to use a fining agent. Though adding bentonite, now even, will help compact your lees and capture those free floating apple bits. So perhaps pectinase and bentonite are needed.

__________________

Motto: quel che sara sara

saramc is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 02:41 AM   #5
centworthy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 31
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by saramc
Did you dose it well with pectinase? Fresh pressed cider will clear if you remembered to use enzyme. You can always opt to use a fining agent. Though adding bentonite, now even, will help compact your lees and capture those free floating apple bits. So perhaps pectinase and bentonite are needed.
Good point, I did add pectin enzyme in the primary but it may not have been enough judging by how much has dropped to the bottom and yet still floating. Can I add more pectin enzyme at this point?
__________________
centworthy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 03:38 AM   #6
StevenM
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: St. Charles, mo
Posts: 37
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

I have only used fresh pressed cider for my cyser. It has always been clear. I use pectonase and time. Just don't heat the apple juice if you want it to clear. Heat will set the apple cloudy forever. I have ignored everyone on this site and drank the cyser every month thru today. I can say without a shadow of a doubt. The people on this site are correct. Wait 1 year to drink it. Yes you can drink it earlier, but please wait. Heaven is just around the corner. Wait, for the love of Pete, wait.

__________________
StevenM is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 03:47 AM   #7
centworthy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 31
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenM
I have only used fresh pressed cider for my cyser. It has always been clear. I use pectonase and time. Just don't heat the apple juice if you want it to clear. Heat will set the apple cloudy forever. I have ignored everyone on this site and drank the cyser every month thru today. I can say without a shadow of a doubt. The people on this site are correct. Wait 1 year to drink it. Yes you can drink it earlier, but please wait. Heaven is just around the corner. Wait, for the love of Pete, wait.
Thanks, good to hear from someone who has used the same type of cider. No worries, I did not heat it at all, poured into primary straight from the jug. I will take your advise and wait, besides fall is the perfect time of year for cyser ( in my opinion) and since I pitched this one in September it will be 1 yr old next time fall rolls around and should be, as you said, "heaven" by then....and hopefully clear
__________________
centworthy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 03:53 AM   #8
Bluespark
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 417
Liked 26 Times on 20 Posts

Default

This is sort of a cyser, honey and apple cider of the type you've described, about 10% abv, just back sweetened with caramel syrup, about 2 months old.i'm happy with the clarity, especially with no pectin enzyme.

image-1357820402.jpg

__________________
Bluespark is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 09:42 AM   #9
fatbloke
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: UK - South Coast.
Posts: 2,682
Liked 174 Times on 161 Posts
Likes Given: 26

Default

Not bad looking Bluespark, but it looks (not sure if it's the brew or the picture) like there's still a little haziness in there.

Which I'd have thought, will eventually settle out in the bottle giving you even greater clarity, but you have to be careful when pouring/serving as the last glass or two will probably pick up a little bit of what drops out over time....

As for the OP, most apple juice when pressed, has at least some cloudiness to it. If it's "gin clear" (except for the colour/oxidation level of the juice) then it's likely been filtered.

The only reason for filtration of the juice is for marketing reasons i.e. it looks prettier when clear. The cloudy stuff is likely more natural, though equally it does tend to darken with oxidation over time - which is usually why they add some preservatives, though generally stuff like sulphites or ascorbic acid/vitamin C. The former needs dissipating if present, whereas the later is fine to ferment with "as is".

Some places preserve with sodium benzoate, which is a complete PITA, as it's hard to remove/minimise enough for fermentation, though the juice is fine for back sweetening or flavouring.

Pectolase/pectic enzyme, not only helps with pectins (which is another option for the cloudiness in your batch) but anecdotally it also helps with flavour and colour extraction.

Apples go brown naturally through oxidation, pressing the apples then allowing the oxidation naturally is one of the techniques associated with Normandy Cider (though I understand it also tends to be lower in alcohol generally than the ciders here).

Either way, it's less of a problem as this sort of issue is generally easily sorted out......

__________________

"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away". Tom Waits.

Oh, and here's some blog stuff!

fatbloke is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-28-2012, 02:11 PM   #10
centworthy
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 31
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts

Default

Great pic Bluespark I figured I'd add mine so you can see where it's at after nearly 3 months. As you can see its still pretty opaque even though a lot has settled to the bottom. I will be racking , testing and topping off this weekend ( that's the buckwheat bochet next to it that was started in Oct)

image-3240557663.jpg

__________________
centworthy is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Freesh pressed cider Firstnten Cider Forum 7 11-05-2009 04:56 PM
s.g. of Fresh Pressed Cider? coldrice Cider Forum 13 11-02-2009 02:21 PM
Dealing with self-pressed cider talenos Cider Forum 5 10-31-2009 10:41 PM
Fresh pressed apple juice for Cyser question ruger12pk Mead Forum 8 10-24-2009 03:35 AM
Pressed Cider Question Macrorie Cider Forum 4 10-10-2008 07:24 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS