Pale Ale - Does this look right?

I took my first shot at AG brewing using BIAB method today. Below is the recipe I used: (Trying to make a Pale Ale)

9 Lbs Pale 2-row
1 Lbs Crystal 60L
12oz Carapils

Mashed at 152F for 85 minutes, did not do a mash out.
My Water Volume called for 7 gallons but due to high boil off I went with 8 gallons to start. I squeezed the hell out of the bag and felt like I got most of it out. The grain was not double crushed so I expected efficiency of around 60%, I stirred multiple times and my kettle held good temp (15 gallon SS kettle).

Boiled for 60m, starting boil volume was just under 7 gallons which is what I expected and was happy with.

Hop additions:
Summit 1oz (60m)
Cascade .5oz (15m)
Cascade .5oz (1m)

Added 1 tablet of whirlfloc at 15m

Using a wort chiller, chilled to 75F, took about 25 minutes total.

Transferred to sanitized glass 6.5 gallon carboy using tubing and ball valve directly from kettle, did not filter anything.

Hydrometer reading pre-boil showed 1.030 which I was not expecting, also checked on my refractometer and got the same so I am quite sure it's valid, however, thought possibly was lower due to the extra water I used.

I ended up with almost exactly 5 gallons after boil off and cooling so I felt like I hit what I wanted to but I was busy and forgot to get another sample to check OG. I am contemplating somehow getting a sample out of the carboy but I don't have a thief so thinking this one through, I don't need much because I can just use the hydrometer.

Am I right in that a 1.030 SG with 7 gallons is about 54% efficiency?

And....Is it worth it at this point to risk the batch on getting a sample to check OG of the boiled wort?

Posting a picture below because I was expecting a much lighter color on the wort, is this common for a pale ale?

All your calculations sound correct, couldnt say for sure with out doing the math. But first impressions nothing jumped out as crazy off. The color is hard to comment on from just a picture on my screen. but about what I would expect based on your grain bill. I dont do biab very often. I am not an efficiency nerd, but less than 60% is hard to swallow. Sounds like you made a hoppy table beer.

Was this your first AG BIAB?

Oh, and no it's not worth stealing a sample from. You could add candi sugar to it, or white table sugar, or even some dme if you want to up the ABV

This was absolutely my first BIAB.

I was thinking worst case I should get around 60% without double crushing the grain and doing the longer mash. I can say this didn't seem like a time saver, although I found that I got a lot of work done in the garage while I was mashing. Finished the build on my Mini-Fridge Kegerator converson so all is not lost.

Not to worried about the ABV, I suspect with my boil-off that I should bee between 1.045-1.050 OG (post boil).

Guess I'll be buying that mill I've been looking at to get my efficiency up. I was also toying with the idea of doing some sparging or perhaps even recirculating.

The guy at the LHBS I bought the grain from said I didn't need to do a double crush but I'm thinking he was just being lazy, I suppose with my own mill I can crush it to my spec without having to worry about anyone else opinion...

Thanks for the comments.

The guy at the LHBS I bought the grain from said I didn't need to do a double crush but I'm thinking he was just being lazy, I suppose with my own mill I can crush it to my spec without having to worry about anyone else opinion...

Click to expand...

The guy at the LHBS probably has never done a BIAB beer before and didn't realize how much of a difference it can make and probably doesn't care too much anyway because the milling of the grain is a service that doesn't make money, grain sales do.

You leave quite a bit of sugar stuck to the grains when you don't sparge. With even a small amount of cold water for sparging I gain 5% or more efficiency.

The colour looks fine, beers always look considerably darker in a large vessel like that. When you pour a glass, it should be just right.

Also, don't lift a full carboy with that red handle you have on the neck of the carboy. It stresses the glass and can result in a catastrophic failure. Get some proper BrewHauler straps, or use a milk crate, or even just lift it carefully from the bottom. But don't lift it from the neck with that handle.

quick question: did you use pale ale malt or pale malt, they have different SRM values. I just typed your recipe into beersmith for a quick look. It looks to me that if you expected 60%, you probably needed another pound or two of grain to hit your numbers. I go back and forth between beersmith and brewers friend to compare and contrast their estimates.

my first BIAB (about a month ago) was a pale ale (SMaSH from AHS) and I used 11lbs of pale ale malt to pretty good effect for a 5.25 gallon batch. Total efficiency was 71 percent. Yours definitely looks darker, but as other posters said, it's hard to tell. I ferment in a white bucket

good luck, I'm sure it will be awesome!

I used straight pale malt 2-row + the specialty grains. The color is looking right on target now. Trying to clone Georgetown Brewing Manny's Pale Ale. I lost nearly 2 gallons of water in a 60 minute boil so I may have been near the FG target of 1.054.

All of the info I've found indicates this recipe is close so I'm crossing my fingers. Wish I would have remembered to take a gravity reading after the wort cooled but oh well.

If it's delicious I can only make it better next time, right?

I've done about 8 BIAB since last summer & since then I've adjusted my process to solve the problem your having (I had it initially as well). My lhbs won't do a double crush either, I think that's fairly common. I always mash out now and always sparge. I also take a pre-boil gravity reading after the mash to see where I'm at. If it's not within a couple points of where I'll need to be, I add dme to boost the sugars. Here:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/formula-determine-how-much-dme-add-when-pre-boil-gravity-missed-185394/

+1 to the comment about not being able to tell much about the color from such a large vessel. Look at the siphon tube when you transfer later, that'll be much closer to what you were hoping for. Best of luck.

edit: sorry, just noticed you took the pre-boil reading & not the post-boil. You should be fine, 1.030 is within 2pts of 1.050.

I've always interpreted "points" like this: the difference between 1.055 and 1.056 as "one point of difference" yes? no?

+1 on the mash out and sparge comment. I agree completely. It has helped me hit 70% on my first two BIAB batches.

It's dark because of all that crystal 60. You will probably end up closer to hoppy brown. I usually don't use anything darker than 40 in a pale ale, if at all. I also mash at 150 or lower. If doing IPA or higher gravity I sometimes add some dextrose to keep it dry.

I wouldn't sweat your SG - post boil you probably got about where I would expect to be... it'll be fine, should be tasty.

My basic pale recipe at this point is something like this:
12# 2 row
1# flaked barley (same result as carapils, but cheaper)
4oz honey malt
4oz crystal 20

1oz 12% AA at 60
1oz 7% AA at 30
1oz 7% AA at 0
1oz 7% AA dry hop 1 week

Do you BIAB in a single vessel? I BIAB, but I do my mashing in an insulated round cooler. After the mash, I drain the bag and squeeze the hell out of it, draining all that liquid into my brew kettle. I then put the bag back into the mash-cooler, and add a couple more gallons of 170-180 degree water (although many have reported good results with just cold/room temp water). This step I call my dunk-batch-sparge step. I leave it about 10-15 mins, and stir really well at the beginning, in the middle, and just before draining & also squeezing the bag again for these "2nd runnings". (I also stir really well throughout the mash a couple times). With my process, I usually hit somewhere between 75-80 percent efficiency and overshoot Beersmith numbers.

It seems your on the right track. My big recommendations for BIAB (single vessel or using a 2nd vessel) are definitely to get a double crush, stir when mixing grains, at least once throughout mash and/or rinsing/sparging, and just before draining to make sure all the sugars are rinsed off. Your efficiency will no doubt get better. And do to forget the squeeze that bag! (Hard to say that without smirking...)


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

I used a single 15 gallon kettle but I have an 8 gallon kettle and a 5 gallon kettle I could easily use for this.

I'm backed up with to much beer fermenting so it may be a couple weeks before I get to try again. At least I'll have my mill by then.

I've never done single vessel BIAB, so I'm not bashing it at all. I do like being able to use a standard water to grain ratio, and I think the sparge step increases efficiency. Although, that's just my setup and it works well for me. I've seen a lot of praise for single vessel, and if you have a big enough kettle to do it in, then it still might be a great option, and there's a lot of good info on it in this forum. I think they both have their pros and cons, but I wasn't necessarily promoting one over the other. From what I've read, you may have PH issues that need tweaking with a full volume mash (no personal experience with this in particular), and you may simply need to add a couple extra pounds of malt to get the boost in gravity points (minimal extra cost for a pound or two of grain). If interested, try the same recipe both ways, and see what you like better. Either way, a good double crush and squeezing like crazy are two things (if that's all you do) that really help BIAB brewers get better efficiency.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

It doesn't take much dark crystal or malt additions to add a lot of color quickly. That was one of the first things I learned to get a handle on when I started brewing. If you want a really light ale, stick with the lightest color additions you can find.

I like to use carapils as a crystal malt addition to give body, sweetness, and minimal color when I'm doing a light Pale Ale or IPA. 20L crystal is as dark as I would want to go if I was shooting for a light golden colored Ale. However, I rarely want to brew a really light colored ale. I like that nice golden red and copper color.

I recently brewed a beer, bottled it 2 days ago, that is a nice light colored Pale Ale for my brothers birthday. I used a pound of honey malt for sweetness. It turned out a nice golden yellow. The rest was all 2-row base malt, Centenial hops, and a pound of honey to boost the ABV.

After a couple days it appears to be the exact color I was looking for. I think I panicked when it looked so dark initially.

I also used whirlfloc for the first time which made things look different than I'm used to.

A local brewery uses the same tap water for brewing with no treatment and I love all of their beer so while not scientific I was hopeful it was ok. I've been meaning to get Palmer's new book "water" to try and learn a few things as well.

BigDog007 said:

After a couple days it appears to be the exact color I was looking for. I think I panicked when it looked so dark initially.

I also used whirlfloc for the first time which made things look different than I'm used to.

A local brewery uses the same tap water for brewing with no treatment and I love all of their beer so while not scientific I was hopeful it was ok. I've been meaning to get Palmer's new book "water" to try and learn a few things as well.

Click to expand...

Awesome! Glad it all worked out. Sometimes you can be thrown off by the color you see in the fermentation vessel. There is a big difference between a looking at the color of a 12 ounce glass and 5 gallons of the stuff in a big container. :rockin:

Please keep updating us. I'd like to know how this one turns out

Update: this turned out very well. Amazing how well this yeast cleaned up. The LHBS said I would love this yeast and he was right.

Drank my first bomber a few minutes ago and am very pleased with the results. Love it!!!!

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1427074982.572151.jpg

Almost done with my E-BIAB so now I get to try a new exciting process!

BigDog007 said:

Update: this turned out very well. Amazing how well this yeast cleaned up. The LHBS said I would love this yeast and he was right.

Drank my first bomber a few minutes ago and am very pleased with the results. Love it!!!!

View attachment 265765

Almost done with my E-BIAB so now I get to try a new exciting process!

Click to expand...

That looks terrific. Well done sir.

Looks great. I will say the one thing that helped with my BIAB brews was the crush - my first BIAB I just used the mill at the LHBS, and was way under on OG. I bought a grain crusher, cranked by hand, and WOW did it make a difference.

Very nice. I use the mill at my LHBS. I've tried twice milling and I notice no real difference in efficiency. I tend to be in the 70-75% range (generally 70% if over 1.065 and abou 75% closer to 1.050) most of the time. However, do a two step batch sparge with my BiaB using a 6 gallon and a 5 gallon pot heating up water seperately, squeeze the crap out of my grain bag during each step and ensure I hit at least 160F for mash out each time.

With about 20 odd BiaB sessions under my belt refining this has added maybe 4-5 points of efficiency. I started in the mid-60's my first 2-3 BiaB brews and have crept up to the low/mid 70's now. Generally I just take the recipe out of the calculator (the calulator I use it set for 75% efficiency) and if I care that much about hitting the exact gravity I'll generally add 8-16oz of base malt depending on the batch size and gravity.

If you want light color go with crystal 10 or 20- but not any darker and not much is needed say 6 ounces or so.

Color looks about right. 1lb of C-60 is high for 5 gallon batch though unless you want a more malty body to your pale ale.

Something no one has addressed is the ore boil gravity reading. Temperature correction at 148F that gravity reading is a 1.049. What temp was the pre boil taken at? 69 or 150? Because it makes a MASSIVE DIFFERENCE.

Also there are calculators online you can enter your grain bill, volumes and estimated efficiency and get a FG. It will also tell you our actual efficiency with your final volume. Check it out. I think it is tastey brew mash calculator.

I do full volume BIAB and I can hit 75% so don't let people tell you that using multiple pots and sparging while keeping the grains in a bag is going to make better beer or increase your efficiency. If it was then 3 vessel/moving the grains to different vessels would be the only way people brewed because it would he so much better. Stir the mash every 20 minutes really good to prevent stratification and check temps.

I don't recall when I took the sample but for some reason I think I cooled it off in the fridge first before taking a hydro reading.

It is definitely tasty ale and I will brew it again for sure.

DurtyChemist said:

Something no one has addressed is the ore boil gravity reading. Temperature correction at 148F that gravity reading is a 1.049. What temp was the pre boil taken at? 69 or 150? Because it makes a MASSIVE DIFFERENCE.

Also there are calculators online you can enter your grain bill, volumes and estimated efficiency and get a FG. It will also tell you our actual efficiency with your final volume. Check it out. I think it is tastey brew mash calculator.

I do full volume BIAB and I can hit 75% so don't let people tell you that using multiple pots and sparging while keeping the grains in a bag is going to make better beer or increase your efficiency. If it was then 3 vessel/moving the grains to different vessels would be the only way people brewed because it would he so much better. Stir the mash every 20 minutes really good to prevent stratification and check temps.

Click to expand...

Excellent point. Its why I keep my phone handy on brew day so I can do things like hydrometer temperature adjustments since I always take a reading at about 145-158F which easily throws the reading off low by 50-80%.

In regards to your color, I'd suggest using about the equivalent of 1lb of C40 per 5G (assuming modest ~1.055 OG).

You can slice and dice this a few different ways.
-4lbs of C10 (actually don't do that :cross
-1lb C10 + 0.5lb C20 + 0.33lb C60
-0.5lb C20 + 0.5lb C60, etc, etc.

This will give you a nice copper color.