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Old 10-04-2012, 07:10 AM   #81
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So what was wrong with what I said besides a trivial misspelling on my iPhone?
That's funny, my iPhone brought up the misspelling loud and clear. What was wrong with it was that you mischaracterized everyone's role in this discussion, attempted to act as some kind of an authority, and then went on to write a 4 post, 2000 word rant on what idiots and conspiracy theorists we all are. And then in the end all you have is a bunch of Google links, just like anyone else on the Internets can provide. Since my mother has been a medical professional for the past 35 years, and currently teaches the kind of classes you hope to graduates from, I can tell you that there is just as much bias in the medical community as one would expect, which is not surprising seeing the swanky restaurants and retreats she goes to on the dime of the drug reps.
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:12 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by bottlebomber

That's funny, my iPhone brought up the misspelling loud and clear. What was wrong with it was that you mischaracterized everyone's role in this discussion, attempted to act as some kind of an authority, and then went on to write a
Fine, believe what you want. That's been my experience with such people anyhow.
Have a nice day!
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Old 10-04-2012, 07:18 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bottlebomber

That's funny, my iPhone brought up the misspelling loud and clear. What was wrong with it was that you mischaracterized everyone's role in this discussion, attempted to act as some kind of an authority, and then went on to write a 4 post, 2000 word rant on what idiots and conspiracy theorists we all are. And then in the end all you have is a bunch of Google links, just like anyone else on the Internets can provide. Since my mother has been a medical professional for the past 35 years, and currently teaches the kind of classes you hope to graduates from, I can tell you that there is just as much bias in the medical community as one would expect, which is not surprising seeing the swanky restaurants and retreats she goes to on the dime of the drug reps.
Believe what you want.
You just edited too lol..

I cited some of the most reputable medical journals and organizations in the world and you see it is a random google search and therefore not credible? What would you call credible, then?

I don't take classes actually, I do clinical rotations. Done with classes.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:44 AM   #84
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Actually, it's true. HIV is extremely volatile and won't survive long outside a bodily fluid.
That's not what I was talking about.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:14 PM   #85
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Deleted, useless convo

Nothing in my edit changed my point, it just added to my credentials to speak on the matter.
Nor have I been inconsistent or not truthful.

But hey, believe what you want if it makes you feel safe and happy.
Congratulations, just like you, I am not a doctor. However, I have worked in Quality and R&D for an FDA regulated company for over 10 years and I am a board member on an FDA Regulatory and Compliance board. I know a LOT more about FDA and science than you might think I do. I have also been involved in multiple research projects. At this point, I suppose that I know more about this topic than you do.
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:26 PM   #86
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This summarizes the lack of flu vaccine efficacy quite nicely:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1....pub4/abstract

http://www.safeminds.org/protect-you...20analysis.pdf

For those short on attention span, here is the summary in a nutshell:

The combined results of these trials showed that under ideal conditions (vaccine completely matching circulating viral configuration) 33 healthy adults need to be vaccinated to avoid one set of influenza symptoms. In average conditions (partially matching vaccine) 100 people need to be vaccinated to avoid one set of influenza symptoms.

Influenza vaccines have a modest effect in reducing influenza symptoms and working days lost. There is no evidence that they affect
complications, such as pneumonia, or transmission.

WARNING:
This review includes 15 out of 36 trials funded by industry (four had no funding declaration). An earlier systematic review of 274
influenza vaccine studies published up to 2007 found industry funded studies were published in more prestigious journals and cited
more than other studies independently from methodological quality and size. Studies funded from public sources were significantly
less likely to report conclusions favorable to the vaccines. The review showed that reliable evidence on influenza vaccines is thin but
there is evidence of widespread manipulation of conclusions and spurious notoriety of the studies. The content and conclusions of this
review should be interpreted in light of this finding.

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Old 10-10-2012, 12:47 AM   #87
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Good stuff, and not surprising one bit.

One thing that we aren't often told, is that when any industry (or anyone with monetary interests) funds a study, they often say to whoever is conducting the study, "find us a link between ______ and ______" or "we're looking for data that suggests _____ doesn't have any effect on _____." Really tends to influence whatever conclusions are drawn from the study, and in turn of course, the "results" that we hear about.

It basically means is that if you aren't looking at who's conducting the study and taking that into account, you could be citing absolutely worthless information.

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Old 10-10-2012, 12:57 AM   #88
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Believe what you want.
You just edited too lol..

I cited some of the most reputable medical journals and organizations in the world and you see it is a random google search and therefore not credible? What would you call credible, then?

I don't take classes actually, I do clinical rotations. Done with classes.
First major point in trying to argue something: If you are in school for something related to the topic (i.e in this case either an MD or RN STUDENT) do not act like you know jack-S because in reality you have not passed your boards and you command zero respect. The majority of new doctors I have had the experience of being around (I am a registered nurse) are not that knowledgeable. You will learn 10 times more in your first year of being an MD than you ever learned in school. Don't use "med student" as a pedestal, it means literally nothing to anyone, especially those in the medical field.

On topic: I do not believe in the flu vaccine for anyone but children and the elderly or the immuno-compromised.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:12 AM   #89
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I have passed Step one boards, actually. Did really well I might add :P
Taking CS in a few months and CK in May.
Been published numerous times for medical research and am spending a few months of fourth year doing research.

My gist was dispelling wives tales about vaccinations, rather than commenting on the efficacy of the influenza vaccine in particular.
I might add, I was up all night doing a presentation on current Immunosuppressive therapy for transplant surgery patients and endocrine surgery. Needless to say, I was extremely tired and rather irritable. It was a sleepless night.
I sincerely apologize for being so abrasive - it was definitely out of line. The demanding schedule of surgery rotation is taking its toll on me.

Edit: addition of reputable resources to ponder, since this is the direction it's taking
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...64410X10018220
http://www.cmaj.ca/content/183/13/E1025
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...295-X/abstract (a broad meta-study)

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Old 10-11-2012, 07:26 PM   #90
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I blame you for all this, Dog.

Personally I dont get a flu shot because I am uninsured.

Whether or not the flu shot is effective and necessary (and let me tell you, 9 pages in and I care less then when I started reading) the anti-vaccine people have horrid PR. Those who talk most about childhood vaccines are expecting and new mothers... and their voice is often marginalized... they are just scared new mothers after all, they're supposed to freak out about things. Celebrity endorsement? An actor no one has seen in anything compelling since "Singled Out," a gig she hated by the way, and who might have PLAYED a doctor or medical professional in her college days in the black box theater. No one is really listening. You have the AMA on one side, Playboy model and professional poolside microphone holder Jenny McCarthy on the other.

But now that I got that out, what I WILL say is this: I drink New York City tapwater daily and frequent subway platforms... I feel pretty confident that minute levels of mercury arent going to be what takes me down when taken once a year...

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