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Old 06-11-2012, 04:20 PM   #871
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"fraid that's just something some leagues have to live with. Players only have short careers and need to follow the money and the experience of higher levels. It will get better over time. Ya just can't rush these things.
It's true but that just seems to be where people immediately jump. They've done it for Brek Shea, Teal Bunbury, Omar Gonzalez.... the list goes on. There needs to be a core group of youngsters that dedicate themselves to the betterment of the American game rather than a higher paycheck (and likely less PT.)

But at least sometimes it works out.... Tim Ream (good riddance) went to the Premiership and later got relegated, so that's not too bad.
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Old 06-11-2012, 04:23 PM   #872
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The playing time is a key issue, I think, Reno. But I have no problem with the very best US players playing in the very best international leagues, as long as they get playing time and develop. And play on the US national team!

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Old 06-11-2012, 04:24 PM   #873
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Here's a cheer for Sweden today! Would love to have both Denmark and Sweden make out of their groups - an all-Scandinavian finals! Woot!

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Old 06-11-2012, 06:19 PM   #874
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It's true but that just seems to be where people immediately jump. They've done it for Brek Shea, Teal Bunbury, Omar Gonzalez.... the list goes on. There needs to be a core group of youngsters that dedicate themselves to the betterment of the American game rather than a higher paycheck (and likely less PT.)

But at least sometimes it works out.... Tim Ream (good riddance) went to the Premiership and later got relegated, so that's not too bad.
It's sort of a paradoxical setup that is developing here. On one hand it seems like MLS and MLS teams are willing to shell out big style for aging has beens from European leagues whereas it's pretty well recognized that if you're a young talented US player you'll make more cash in Europe...

Perhaps the MLS might want to spend some more cash to keep the bright US talent in our league rather than using it to line David Beckham's already overflowing pockets?
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Old 06-11-2012, 06:49 PM   #875
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aygov, good points.

But they made alterations to the Designated Player rule for this season and on. There is more of an incentive to sign young players as DPs seeing as the younger the player, the less they count against the salary cap.


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Designated Player over the age of 23 will carry a salary budget charge of $350,000, unless the player joins his club in the middle of the season, in which case his budget charge will be $175,000.

Designated Player 21-23 years old counts as $200,000 against the club’s salary budget.

Designated Player 20 years old or younger counts as $150,000 against the club’s salary budget.

The budget charge for the midseason signing of a young Designated Player (23 years old and younger) is $150,000 and this amount cannot be lowered with allocation funds.

Clubs will not have to buy the third DP roster slot to accommodate Designated Players 23 years old and younger.

Age of player is determined by year (not date) of birth.
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Old 06-11-2012, 08:33 PM   #876
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That is good start and hopefully it will evolve from there.

Unfortunately if it ends up in a bidding war I think the MLS will always lose. There is so much silly money flying around in Europe now....

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Old 06-11-2012, 09:27 PM   #877
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Think about the Dutch though - their league is not the greatest - yet their players are (arguably, very arguably...) some of the best the world has to offer. I'm not sure one needs a good league to produce good players.

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Old 06-12-2012, 01:05 AM   #878
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Originally Posted by Reno_eNVy View Post
It's true but that just seems to be where people immediately jump. They've done it for Brek Shea, Teal Bunbury, Omar Gonzalez.... the list goes on. There needs to be a core group of youngsters that dedicate themselves to the betterment of the American game rather than a higher paycheck (and likely less PT.)

But at least sometimes it works out.... Tim Ream (good riddance) went to the Premiership and later got relegated, so that's not too bad.
I have to agree with the point Pappers brought up... doesn't the best american players playing in the best league they can count as being "for the betterment of the American game"? I mean, I guess it depends on how you define the American game. If you mean pro soccer in america, then no, players going overseas does not directly aid soccer in america. But if you mean the national team, I think its hard to argue that a player going to a high level european league and getting playing time isn't better for their development than staying in the MLS at this point. Now, obviously going over there and sitting doesn't help at all.

As for the MLS shelling out money for big name, albeit over the hill, European stars... I'm all for it. They can teach the young 'uns.
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Old 06-12-2012, 01:15 AM   #879
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I have to agree with the point Pappers brought up... doesn't the best american players playing in the best league they can count as being "for the betterment of the American game"? I mean, I guess it depends on how you define the American game. If you mean pro soccer in america, then no, players going overseas does not directly aid soccer in america. But if you mean the national team, I think its hard to argue that a player going to a high level european league and getting playing time isn't better for their development than staying in the MLS at this point. Now, obviously going over there and sitting doesn't help at all.

As for the MLS shelling out money for big name, albeit over the hill, European stars... I'm all for it. They can teach the young 'uns.
Fair enough. But my train of thought is more long term:

- Keep the stars in MLS (immediately better for MLS)
- Gain international attention from strong showings at friendlies and minor tournaments (WFC, Emirates Cup, etc)
- Keep expanding and raise the cap. That's more spots for current stars and young sleepers and more money to keep them in the country. Also, more money to bring in the big-timers.
- A larger pool of improved players in the country not only creates a better national team on paper but creates familiarity between players since they'd see each other all the time in the league. Not only that but it allows for regulars on the USMNT to develop a true American-style game. It's slowly happening, though. And it's similar to how MLS works: hard, physical, sometimes rough play but minimal to zero diving or cheap crap.

Over time, through attention, improvement of the game, improved attendance, and more country-wide soccer exposure (it just keeps getting better. Just look at the attendance for the recent friendlies) we'll create a league that just pumps out super stars.

It's a long journey ahead but it's doable with more money and work. And that includes the supporters as well. It's your job to spread the love of the sport!!
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Old 06-12-2012, 01:37 AM   #880
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Quote:
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Fair enough. But my train of thought is more long term:

- Keep the stars in MLS (immediately better for MLS)
- Gain international attention from strong showings at friendlies and minor tournaments (WFC, Emirates Cup, etc)
- Keep expanding and raise the cap. That's more spots for current stars and young sleepers and more money to keep them in the country. Also, more money to bring in the big-timers.
- A larger pool of improved players in the country not only creates a better national team on paper but creates familiarity between players since they'd see each other all the time in the league. Not only that but it allows for regulars on the USMNT to develop a true American-style game. It's slowly happening, though. And it's similar to how MLS works: hard, physical, sometimes rough play but minimal to zero diving or cheap crap.

Over time, through attention, improvement of the game, improved attendance, and more country-wide soccer exposure (it just keeps getting better. Just look at the attendance for the recent friendlies) we'll create a league that just pumps out super stars.

It's a long journey ahead but it's doable with more money and work. And that includes the supporters as well. It's your job to spread the love of the sport!!
I certainly see your points, and I think the main thing is that a strong MLS is certainly good for the US soccer culture in general. And I'm glad that I'm not in charge of how things work, because I'd surely F things up. But I would just argue that the growth and development of the league isn't hampered much by losing a handful of high level american pros to Europe. Meanwhile if the development of a handful of high level american pros is hampered by staying in a league that isn't quite at their level does significantly hamper the national team. By all means, as long as you can grow in the MLS, do it. But I just don't believe that say, dempsey, would be the player he is now if he had stayed in the MLS.

As for the development of an american style based on hard work and minimal cheap crap... you don't feel that that's already developed as the american style? I feel like that's what the USMNT has been known for ever since they actually started making it to WCs again.
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