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Old 03-13-2013, 05:57 PM   #11
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Can I ask where you got this information?
I spoke with a representative at NCM. However the pricing they have provided via updated price sheet so you can compare the numbers yourself. I did my estimates off of our former costs in our group buy vs. the new "Home Brewer's" price sheet.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:02 PM   #12
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Just wondering if you are aware of what has happened to the price of say for instance corn, or hay over the past year?. Here in the Midwest the price corn has doubled in the past year. Hay has more than doubled. A bale that just 2 years ago you could have bought for $2.50 is now selling for $7 and upwards.....if you can find it. We feed horses and a few cows so I am totally aware of what is and has happened in the grains and feed markets. I watch the futures markets and although I am no expert I see the trends that when one of them shoots up the others follow. Last growing season was a terrible one in the midwest for grains of all sorts. Add to this the ever increasing diversion of foodstuff grains to ethanol production and the price of not only the remaining grain stock but also everything made from it skyrockets. You may not brew with corn but when the price of corn goes up you can bet other grains will not be left far behind. Supply/Demand/Greed......whatever. And then you add in the international trade of all of the above and the increasing demands for them in China and other areas of the world.

I am not here to start a point the finger or blame this one or that one thread. All I am saying is that before you begin to put the word out on end producers you might want to consider what has happened to their costs and prices. The maltier has to buy his barley from someone. The guy growing the barley has to put ever costlier diesel in his tractors and fertilizers on his crops. And we will end up paying more at the end of the chain. Is it just this one supplier that has increased his pricing or is this a general trend that is or will soon appear in the pricing from all of them?

I applaud and support the guys that supply our hobby and am not too quick to turn them against us making it even harder and more expensive to obtain what we need to brew.

Just a few thoughts.......

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Old 03-13-2013, 06:02 PM   #13
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However they increased the price, so my interpretation is that they are hoping to make the same money, by selling less grain. So higher cost, less product. At the end they still make the same money, we just get less because we are home brewers.
right, and that formula works only if the amount sold doesn't decrease more than the price increased. our only play at this point is to reduce the amount sold, AKA buy somewhere else. that's how we can hurt 'em (maybe).

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From the brewersupply website

Importantly, the “new” BSG we will continue to carry the portfolio of brands of both previously separate
companies. As we go forward, therefore, you can rely on the same inventory for your business as in the
past! The “new” BSG will also continue the old C&B policy of never selling directly to end-users—not in
person, and not online!
thanks for posting that. now we know the thinking behind the decision: they want to remain loyal to their B2B customers.

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Can I ask where you got this information?
what are you asking about, the 20% increase? they announced it to all homebrew clubs this past week.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:03 PM   #14
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Can I ask where you got this information?
Look at any of the recent grain group buys and you will see. In the last 30 days NCM has stopped giving wholesale prices to any "Non business". NCM has published a "Homebrewer price list" which is significantly (20%+) higher than the old wholesale price we were given for 42+ sack orders.


Personally I think the best scenario is to find small homebrew shops willing to sell base malt sacks to customers at a very reasonable markup with the knowledge that by doing so he/she will attract customers to the shop who would otherwise have ordered other items online (yeast, specialty malts, bottle caps, etc, etc).
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:06 PM   #15
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It would be interesting to know. However they increased the price, so my interpretation is that they are hoping to make the same money, by selling less grain. So higher cost, less product. At the end they still make the same money, we just get less because we are home brewers....
Either that or someone got to them and made them stop selling to private home brewers/club accounts at wholesale pricing.

CMG's business is to supply raw product to breweries and LHBSs. Although the group buys are not insignificant, in that business model they must only represent a few drops in their sales bucket.

In that light, it makes little sense for a company that size to even want to handle small individual quantities shipped by Fedex, rather than pallet loads at a time on a large truck. Yet, if that's the case, someone in the company may be trying to build a career by selling peanuts at retail pricing, but that scenario is not likely.

I have the feeling someone got to them.

And it is definitely a good idea to find alternative distributors and see if we can entice them to be competitive. It also sends a message to CMG.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:24 PM   #16
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Where would one find this Homebrewer's Price Sheet ?

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Old 03-13-2013, 06:29 PM   #17
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Where would one find this Homebrewer's Price Sheet ?
I got this link:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/56584482/Ho...%201-11-13.pdf
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:35 PM   #18
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Either that or someone got to them and made them stop selling to private home brewers/club accounts at wholesale pricing.

CMG's business is to supply raw product to breweries and LHBSs. Although the group buys are not insignificant, in that business model they must only represent a few drops in their sales bucket.

In that light, it makes little sense for a company that size to even want to handle small individual quantities shipped by Fedex, rather than pallet loads at a time on a large truck. Yet, if that's the case, someone in the company may be trying to build a career by selling peanuts at retail pricing, but that scenario is not likely.

I have the feeling someone got to them.

And it is definitely a good idea to find alternative distributors and see if we can entice them to be competitive. It also sends a message to CMG.
If you Boycott CMG and buy from your LHBS (or online retailer) that gets its grain through CMG; You really did nothing but increase the orders to CMG through said Home-brew shop.

Either way you throw the ball you have to get your grain from somewhere. If that somewhere gets it grain through CMG, CMG is not effected. You would have to make sure the home brew store does not go through CMG which IMO is a bit hard to organize.

The only true resolution in my eyes are

1. Accept the new prices if they beat your current home-brew store.

For me in MD nothing i less then 70 dollars a bag (not even shipped) and online I cant get a bag for less then 64 shipped. If lived near more beer, or Midwest supplies I would just go to them but I don't.

2. Somebody registers themselves as a business and does the work free of charge and makes 0 profit in reach area. No different then last week.

This could open other problems because you are susceptible to business regulations. if somebody screws up an order for a group buy its oh well sorry next time. If your a registered business you could be attacked differently.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:36 PM   #19
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That's the one. Note that the Briess specialty malts are all about $2/lb now + shipping! I can get specialty malts for $2 shipped from several online retail stores and get them in smaller quantities. I don't think NCM wants homebrewers buying specialty malts from them because that is how most LHBS's make money on grain.
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Old 03-13-2013, 06:36 PM   #20
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Either that or someone got to them and made them stop selling to private home brewers/club accounts at wholesale pricing.

And it is definitely a good idea to find alternative distributors and see if we can entice them to be competitive. It also sends a message to CMG.
I agree that there are more than one factors contributing to the price change.

I also agree that the only way to get competitive pricing is to make businesses compete (this is not an anti-NCM idea). It can only help us all, and NCM become more aligned with the true best pricing available for us.
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