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JohnnyBe 01-22-2013 01:53 AM

Wiring Help
 
4 Attachment(s)
So I need a little help figuring out how to wire a 3 element package I bought from Ryan at electric brewing supply. I plan to adjust the schematic some by changing from a 50 amp spa panel to a 60 amp so that I can power both the Boil and HLT if I ever wanted to do a back to back batch. However with my new system uses 26 gallon kettles so I doubt I will be do that very often.

Here are the questions that I have based on the schematic found here http://www.ebrewsupply.com/designs/50a-BCS-3-Electric.pdf. I've also attached some photos I received from Ryan to reference for layout ideas.

1. For the three element contactors they each have terminals A1, A2, 1, 2, 3, and 4. I think A1 would be the red wire in the diagram from the switch and A2 is the blue wire which goes to the LED. Then 1 and 3 are the power in (3 coming from the SSR) and 2 and 4 is the power to the element plug. Is this correct?

2. For the 63 amp contactor coming in from the GFCI disconnect. What wires go to what terminals on it? It appears that a jumper wire goes from A1 to 1 and is shown as a red 14 gauge wire and then A2 goes to the key switch. And the green LED light is connected to terminals 2 and 4 along with the other wires that then lead to the breakers.

3. What wires go to what terminal on the switches once I add the extra set of NO Contacts that came with them creating 8 terminals on each switch.

4. And lastly does anyone know how to take apart a keyed switch to put it into the box? It doesn't seem like it unscrews or comes apart and I don't want to break it.

stlbeer 01-22-2013 01:08 PM

My suggestion would be to talk to Ryan at ebrewery supply because some of those components might not be rated for 60 amps. Even more so since you show the picture of a switch and you are calling it a contactor.

I'm sure Ryan would be more than happy to help you.

I use 4500w/240v elements in my HLT and BK, a 2000w/240v element in my RIMS and use 2 March pumps and have not had problems brewing back to back on 50 amps. That puts me right at 45.8 amps without pumps.

jCOSbrew 01-22-2013 02:36 PM

Based on the diagram, the only thing preventing you from running both 240v elements is the selector switch which enables the contactor coil on the BK OR the HLT.
You could change this to a 3-way switch with NO and NC contacts to allow you to select BK OR HLT OR BOTH elements. To disable both elements you would need to use the e-stop.

Check your power cord and other wiring to make sure they are adequate for 60 amps.

JohnnyBe 01-22-2013 03:47 PM

3 Attachment(s)
The main contactor (63 amp) from Ryan should be able to handle 60 amp service. The reason I want to use 60 amp instead of 50 is to safely power both 5500 watt elements. 5500/240=22.9 amps 23*2= 46 amps. There should be an 80% factor built in for safety so 60 amps X 80% = 48 amps. This also insures that there is enough amperage to cover the RIMS and pumps if I ever powered it all at once.

So a friend shared this diagram that PJ did which is pretty much what I will be doing. Instead of the buss bars though that he has shown I will be going through the 63 amp contactor then feeding all of the breakers from there. For the contactors though I'm still unsure what wire goes where. I think that PJ's diagram clears it up somewhat for me but maybe someone here can tell me if I'm thinking of this correctly.


Terminal A1 is the neutral
Terminal A2 would be coming from the switch
Terminal 2 is line 1 in
Terminal 4 comes from the SSR terminal 2
Terminal 1 is line 1 out to element plug (Blue in PJ's Diagram)
Terminal 3 is line 2 out to element plug (Red in PJ's Diagram)

The only other item that I will be changing is the power to the BCS 462 since I want it to always be on since it will monitor my fermentation chambers as well. That is an easy thing to do by just pulling in a separate power supply into my control panel for it through another breaker in the spa panel.

jCOSbrew 01-23-2013 02:55 AM

Wire gauge for 60amp (6ga?) is different than 50amp service. Wire from main to sub panel, power cord, and internal wiring to 25amp breakers.

JohnnyBe 01-23-2013 02:34 PM

I was going to pull 4 to the spa panel and into the control panel for the 60 amps. Once again taking into account NEC the wires at 80% for 4 gauge is 56A with a max of 70A.

Getting wire to the spa panel and then to the controller isn't an issue for me. I'm pretty good at residential electrical work and worked in the field doing it. However I never had to wire anything like a motor or such which is why I'm confused by the panel wiring. My old boss use to say "you can train a monkey to wire a house" apparently that monkey will not be able to wire a control panel without help...

jCOSbrew 01-24-2013 12:00 AM

Also upgrade the panels internal wiring from the power cord thru the input contactor and to the breakers. The 25amp breakers and downstream wiring should be adequate.

BadNewsBrewery 01-24-2013 11:10 AM

I'm not really sure what your question is on this one... how to wire the contactor?

The contactor is just a relay. A1 and A2 power the coil, so assuming your contactor has a 120v coil, one of those is neutral, one is hot. Polarity doesn't matter.

I can't tell if your contactor has a suggested load / service orientation, but it shouldn't matter as it's really just a switch. So wire one side up for your service, one side for your load. Bam, you're golden.

JohnnyBe 01-24-2013 02:10 PM

Thanks BadNews that answers the main thing I was still trying to figure out.

ironmountainbrew 01-24-2013 02:13 PM

I was a bit confused wiring my contactor. This pic should help clear things up.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f16/contactors-e-brew-heating-elements-273489/index11.html#post4787722


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