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Old 11-28-2012, 09:24 PM   #1
Andrwb33
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Default Spa panel before 3 wire dryer outlet

Hello all,

Is it possible to instal my spa panel in between the breaker box and my dryer outlet(3 wire).

My idea is this:

-Cut the dryer line in between breaker and dryer outlet
-instal spa panel and 4 wire outlet
-then reconnect existing 3 wire outlet inside spa panel.

Before:
Breaker..........3 wire dryer outlet
After:
Breaker.......spa panel w/4wire outlet........3 wire dryer outlet

I would not use dryer and brewery at the same time. (maybe install a switch to prevent accidental use of both)

Thanks.

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:15 PM   #2
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Disclaimer: I am not an electrician by trade, nor do I claim to know the NEC inside and out.

That said, my interpretation of NEC would be that you can only use that 3-wire circuit in its original form. If you modify the circuit itself I think you would have to bring it up to the current 3-wire with equipment ground (4-wire) code.

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:15 PM   #3
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It should be possible, but I think you would probably be in violation of code to have both on one circuit.
Putting a switch of some sort in line would probably be a good idea. Draw from both at one time would be more than the breaker and probably the wire was rated for.

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:35 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrwb33 View Post
Hello all,
My idea is this:

-Cut the dryer line in between breaker and dryer outlet
-instal spa panel and 4 wire outlet
-then reconnect existing 3 wire outlet inside spa panel.

Before:
Breaker..........3 wire dryer outlet
After:
Breaker.......spa panel w/4wire outlet........3 wire dryer outlet

I would not use dryer and brewery at the same time. (maybe install a switch to prevent accidental use of both)

Thanks.
Not a good idea, but if you do, you still need to run a ground wire for the spa panel.
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Old 11-29-2012, 12:06 AM   #5
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Definitely not a good idea. Out of curiosity, what are you trying to accomplish? The only thing I can think of is that you want to set up your brewing space at some point midway along the wire between the breaker box and the dryer outlet. You would be much better off just using the outlet and plugging the spa panel into it and running off of that. You still only have 2 hots and a ground, so you do not have a neutral to safely run 120V in addition to the 240V.

Lastly, welcome to HBT. I am in North Andover.

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Old 11-29-2012, 01:17 AM   #6
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I'd disagree. A dryer receptacle is almost certainly two hots and neutral, not two hots and ground. The NEMA type of receptacle should tell you this, assuming it's put in to Code.

A 10-XX (XX being the current rating, typically 30 for dryer circuit) would be 120/240V with two hots and neutral. Two hots and ground would be a 6-XX, for 240V only.

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Old 11-29-2012, 02:27 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post
I'd disagree. A dryer receptacle is almost certainly two hots and neutral, not two hots and ground. The NEMA type of receptacle should tell you this, assuming it's put in to Code.

A 10-XX (XX being the current rating, typically 30 for dryer circuit) would be 120/240V with two hots and neutral. Two hots and ground would be a 6-XX, for 240V only.
I suspect you are correct. This is what happens when one knows just enough to be dangerous and posts after a few beers, lol.

Either way, with 3-wires you cannot get both a dedicated neutral and ground, so running both 120V in the panel along with the 240V is not recommended. It would need the fourth wire (the missing ground if 10-XX, or the missing neutral if 6-XX).
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:18 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffmeh View Post
Definitely not a good idea. Out of curiosity, what are you trying to accomplish? The only thing I can think of is that you want to set up your brewing space at some point midway along the wire between the breaker box and the dryer outlet. You would be much better off just using the outlet and plugging the spa panel into it and running off of that. You still only have 2 hots and a ground, so you do not have a neutral to safely run 120V in addition to the 240V.

Lastly, welcome to HBT. I am in North Andover.
Your correct the dryer is on the other side of the basement from the breaker panel. I hope to brew closer to the panel, on top of that the panel is full so I have no more room to run a dedicated brewery outlet.

So my best bet would to just have an electrician rewire a 4 wire outlet at the dryer then plug my spa panel into that for the GFI protection. I like the portability aspect of this. I would just have to make a really long plug for the spa panel.

Now that I'm thinking about it I could skip the spa panel all together and just have the electrician install a GFI protected breaker. (oh boy getting expensive now).

Thanks.

PS Nice to meet someone local. Do you know of any HB clubs in the area?
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:49 PM   #9
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I belong to the Merrimack Valley Home Brew Club. We usually meet the first Saturday of the month, and there is a meeting this Saturday. I don't think I will be able to make it, but if you are interested let me know and I will put you in touch with the host. The website is a bit sparse, but is at www.mvhbc.com.

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