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Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Electric Brewing > GFCI breaker on control box?
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Old 04-12-2011, 08:48 PM   #1
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Default GFCI breaker on control box?

Has anyone had luck mounting a GFCI breaker directly onto their control box?

I would like to use an existing 30A outlet and mount the breaker on the control box instead of in the breaker box.

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Old 04-12-2011, 09:40 PM   #2
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It won't be easy. Breakers are meant to snap down onto power rails inside of the electric panel.

I think someone tried it recently, but I cannot remember who it was or what level of success he had.

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Old 04-13-2011, 12:42 AM   #3
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If you use a DIN style GFCI, you can also buy a piece of the rail, to mount with screws to the back of the panel.
Other than that, not only you can, but it'd be a good thing, as GFCI's tend to work better the closer they are to the load. Just make sure you install it in a way that it'll be protected from any potential spills, and where you won't accidentally hit it with something, and make sure you have a very good connection at the outlet, or, better yet, if you can, try to make a permanent connection to the wall.

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Old 04-16-2011, 07:14 AM   #4
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I was able to find these on Ebay after a little looking.
http://cgi.ebay.com/30A-Grnd-Fault-I...ht_1457wt_1139

I will use this as suggested by Kal in all his great work.

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Old 04-16-2011, 09:29 AM   #5
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Kal recently discovered these cables do not meet NEC code for gfci. These are 10ma, NEC dicates 5ma. Basiclly how fast the gfci will trip. Europe code is 10-30ma, so you decide if you want to use them. I am still going to use mine.

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Old 04-20-2011, 04:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inodoro_Pereyra View Post
...but it'd be a good thing, as GFCI's tend to work better the closer they are to the load.
Please explain why you think this.
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Old 04-20-2011, 05:40 PM   #7
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Quote:
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Please explain why you think this.
I have had bad experiences with GFCIs installed with more than 10ft of wire between them and the load. Wire is reactive (it has inductive and capacitive components) and tends to introduce a delay on the GFCI response time, especially when the load is also reactive (like an electric motor, for example), and, in some cases (happened to me only once, in an install that had water inside the tubing), the added capacity is enough to trip the GFCI for no reason at all.
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:34 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pez View Post
I would like to use an existing 30A outlet and mount the breaker on the control box instead of in the breaker box.
Why?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inodoro_Pereyra View Post
I have had bad experiences with GFCIs installed with more than 10ft of wire between them and the load. Wire is reactive (it has inductive and capacitive components) and tends to introduce a delay on the GFCI response time, especially when the load is also reactive (like an electric motor, for example), and, in some cases (happened to me only once, in an install that had water inside the tubing), the added capacity is enough to trip the GFCI for no reason at all.
GFCI breakers do not trip for no reason at all.
GFCI breakers do not trip because of reactance.

GFCI breakers do trip because of current leakage, usually from ground.
GFCI breakers do trip on the appliance that has amperage higher than rated amperage of the GFCI breaker.

GFCI breakers can have false trips when the load is submerged. False trips will happen regardless of the location of the breaker (whether it's in the control box or in the breaker panel).
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Old 04-20-2011, 10:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarthBound View Post



GFCI breakers do not trip for no reason at all.
GFCI breakers do not trip because of reactance.

GFCI breakers do trip because of current leakage, usually from ground.
GFCI breakers do trip on the appliance that has amperage higher than rated amperage of the GFCI breaker.

GFCI breakers can have false trips when the load is submerged. False trips will happen regardless of the location of the breaker (whether it's in the control box or in the breaker panel).
Nothing in electricity happens for no reason at all. What I meant is that the GFCI would trip for no apparent reason.
GFCI's do trip because of current leakage. Reactance produces current leakage. Capacitance between a hot wire and ground will cause an AC leakage. If that capacitance is high enough, the current leakage will be high enough to trip the GFCI.
GFCI's don't have false trips when the load is submerged. If the load is submerged, the GFCI is supposed to trip.

What I said before I said because of years of personal experience, working as an electrician, and as an electronics technician in industrial environments. I'm sure you think you know all possible theoretical scenarios about GFCI's. Mine are real World scenarios.
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Old 04-20-2011, 10:13 PM   #10
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I'll accept all that (regardless of truth/validity) just to save grace, but what does all that have to do with the location of the breaker? I thought that was the whole point of this thread.

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