Electric Brewing Supply 30A BCS Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Electric Brewing > Element Questions
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10-07-2012, 01:20 PM   #1
questionasker
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wellington, Wellington
Posts: 8
Likes Given: 2

Default Element Questions

So, after all this research I seem to have a general idea of what my setup is going to be. I plan to have a cheap Ebay PID controller and an SSR in a box which can be switched between elements.

I am unsure as to what element to purchase, though. This will be used for heating strike/sparge water, as well as boiling wort, so it should be LWD/ULWD. I have seen the Camco range, and can get one from Amazon (3500W ULWD) for $50 NZD after shipping. This is somewhat high, especially considering the shipping is almost half of the total cost. I have also read that many people receive different model elements from what the listing specifies when ordering from Amazon, which puts me off that TBH. I have found this element on Ebay, and according to my calculations, it is under 50W/in², which makes it ULWD. Even though it is rated for 220V, it will work with a 240V supply, correct? I read CodeRage's sticky, which says "Also 240/220 and 120/110 are interchangeable..." so I am assuming everything will be fine there.

So, does this look like a good setup?

__________________
questionasker is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-07-2012, 01:27 PM   #2
grandequeso
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: jacksonville, fl
Posts: 184
Liked 10 Times on 10 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

that element will work, you just have to configure your own type of way of mounting it into your pot. as it doesnt have the standard 1" screw. The voltage difference is not a problem.

__________________
grandequeso is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-07-2012, 02:11 PM   #3
questionasker
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wellington, Wellington
Posts: 8
Likes Given: 2

Default

Thanks for the reply. I don't think mounting will be too much trouble, as drilling two holes for it should be easy enough.

__________________
questionasker is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-08-2012, 05:56 PM   #4
audger
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: ., Connecticut
Posts: 1,497
Liked 40 Times on 40 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

the rated voltage absoloutely matters... it is true that you can run an element rated for 240v on a 120v circuit; but there is a big difference is in the power output and amp draw that you need to take into account. they arent exactly "interchangable"...

a 4000watt, 240volt element, which pulls 16.6amps, will consume only 1000w / 8.3amps when supplied with 120v.

it has to do with the resistance of the element, in regards to the equation P=IR


as for your original question- you should be able to use any common water heater element you can find. there is no specific type, because there is no such thing as a brewing-specific heating element. as long as you can make it work, you can use it.

__________________
audger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-08-2012, 09:14 PM   #5
grandequeso
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: jacksonville, fl
Posts: 184
Liked 10 Times on 10 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

To be more clear. There is no difference between 220/230/240 volts in relation to water heater elements

__________________
grandequeso is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-09-2012, 12:38 AM   #6
questionasker
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wellington, Wellington
Posts: 8
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by audger View Post
the rated voltage absoloutely matters... it is true that you can run an element rated for 240v on a 120v circuit; but there is a big difference is in the power output and amp draw that you need to take into account. they arent exactly "interchangable"...

a 4000watt, 240volt element, which pulls 16.6amps, will consume only 1000w / 8.3amps when supplied with 120v.

it has to do with the resistance of the element, in regards to the equation P=IR


as for your original question- you should be able to use any common water heater element you can find. there is no specific type, because there is no such thing as a brewing-specific heating element. as long as you can make it work, you can use it.
I get that there will be a difference between 220V input and 240V input. The reason why I ask is that I know what you get from the wall is never 240V. I believe it is usually lower than that.

Lets say we have that element. It uses 3000W of power @ 220V. P=IV, so I=P/V. 3000W/220V=13.64A. R=V/I, so 220V/13.64A=16.13Ω. We know the Voltage I am dealing with (240V) and the resistance (16.13Ω) so all we need is the current. I=V/R, so 240V/16.13Ω=14.88A. P=IV, 14.88A*240V=3571W.

Also, P does not equal I*R. However, P=I²R.

The reason I want a specific type of element is to stop wort scorching. The higher the surface area of the element; the more room the heat has to come in contact with the liquid. If you have a high watt density element, the heat output is more 'concentrated' and more likely to scorch/burn the contents of the pot.
__________________
questionasker is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-09-2012, 09:15 PM   #7
audger
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: ., Connecticut
Posts: 1,497
Liked 40 Times on 40 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
The reason why I ask is that I know what you get from the wall is never 240V. I believe it is usually lower than that.
ok, thats fine. i was just trying to clarify- it sounded like you might have been thinking that a 3000w-rated element is the same wheather fed 120v or 240v...

but yes, an element rated at 240v single phase will work just fine (but with slightly lower wattage) at whatever happens to come out of your wall- like 236v or 225v. same as an element rated at 220v will work, but output slightly more wattage than rated, if fed 240v. you know the math and how to derate/prorate the wattage output based on voltage changes, so that is all you have to take into account.

Quote:
Originally Posted by grandequeso View Post
To be more clear. There is no difference between 220/230/240 volts in relation to water heater elements
this is why i tried to clarify... that is not technically correct- there definately are differences... but for practical purposes, as long as you are aware of the differences, you can ignore them. i just dont like absoloute statements unless i know that all people reading them understand that they arent exactly absoloute.

i try to be as clear as possible, especially when working with high voltages.
__________________
audger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
tri-clover removable element - brewershardware element adapter canyonbrewer Electric Brewing 44 04-22-2013 02:24 AM
1200w 120v Element Questions Antler Electric Brewing 4 06-28-2012 05:01 AM
Heating element questions Patirck Electric Brewing 36 04-20-2012 12:18 PM
Heating Element Questions friedpicklechips Electric Brewing 5 12-30-2011 01:01 PM
Hesting Element questions Guess42 Electric Brewing 8 03-21-2011 02:23 PM