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Old 08-17-2012, 01:38 AM   #11
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Who ever did the wiring in your breaker panel should be taken out and ???

What in hell is a green wire doing going to the output of a GFCI breaker? I suppose this was done by an electrician? If so, he should have his license revoked NOW.!
I knew that would cause a ruckus. It's my work and I cheaped out running 2 separate 240v/30A circuits in one 4-wire cable. I know the colors are wrong but I'm not concerned. Electrically it is OK. The outlets are right next to the breaker panel and is not too hard for anyone to see what I did. It will be ripped out when I leave the house.


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Old 08-17-2012, 01:49 AM   #12
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This is the serious main reason that I recommend using a Spa Panel from HomeDepot to protect the brewery and you. The panel is about $55.

Your power delivery and personal safety is #1 on my list of things that MUST be accomplished.

Please let me know if I can help you in your project development.

P-J
I agree with you on safety being a #1 priority. That being said, I am willing to spend whatever it costs to ensure my well being, and I'm not interested in cutting corners. Afterall, thankfully money isn't really an object at this point of my life.

Now, my apologies in advanced, but I've read so much on these "spa" panels, but I'm not even entirely sure what it is or where it goes. Can i have some insight on this please?
Thanks!


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“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:50 AM   #13
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I knew that would cause a ruckus. It's my work and I cheaped out running 2 separate 240v/30A circuits in one 4-wire cable. I know the colors are wrong but I'm not concerned. Electrically it is OK. The outlets are right next to the breaker panel and is not too hard for anyone to see what I did. It will be ripped out when I leave the house.
You have got to be kidding me....!!!!

Do you know that they make rolls of tape in the various colors to properly flag wiring in electrical panels and the device end power boxes?

I'm astonished!

What you did could possibily be deadly for someone...

Please rethink this.!!!!
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:49 AM   #14
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You have got to be kidding me....!!!!

Do you know that they make rolls of tape in the various colors to properly flag wiring in electrical panels and the device end power boxes?

I'm astonished!

What you did could possibily be deadly for someone...

Please rethink this.!!!!
You need to chill. No one is going to die. There IS black tape on each end to distinguish the green from ground (it's a few inches down on the wire in several spots). I believe this actually makes it up to code (correct me if I'm wrong). I've seen licensed electricians use white wire for hot and put black tape on it and say it's OK. Though I am not a licensed electrician I am aware of most electrical and color codes as I engineer/commission control systems for a living. While I would never do this professionally, I have no problem doing it in my home setup. Like I said, these wires do not run throughout my house. It's a short run and any electrician (like yourself) can clearly see it is not ground and would never tie a ground to it anyway.
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Old 08-17-2012, 06:53 AM   #15
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After doing some more research on Spa Panels, I think I understand them. Please correct any mistakes.

In essence, they are a mini circuit breaker panel that home depot sells for about $60 that include a 50 amp GFI breaker built in. You are to install this in your wall near your existing 240V outlet. The Spa Panel has a power cord that connects to the 240V outlet, and a built in 240V receptacle where your brew control box connects to (at least it will include these things after you manually install them).

The advantages of this are having GFI protection for $60 or so dollars, not having to mess with any of your existing home wiring, and having a kill switch at arms reach during brew day.

Is this correct?

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Originally Posted by BierMuncher View Post

“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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Old 08-17-2012, 10:22 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Cacaman View Post
After doing some more research on Spa Panels, I think I understand them. Please correct any mistakes.

In essence, they are a mini circuit breaker panel that home depot sells for about $60 that include a 50 amp GFI breaker built in. You are to install this in your wall near your existing 240V outlet. The Spa Panel has a power cord that connects to the 240V outlet, and a built in 240V receptacle where your brew control box connects to (at least it will include these things after you manually install them).

The advantages of this are having GFI protection for $60 or so dollars, not having to mess with any of your existing home wiring, and having a kill switch at arms reach during brew day.

Is this correct?
Yes. You use the spa panel to obtain GFCI protection, and if you fit it with a male plug to go into your permanently installed outlet (rather than hardwiring) you have a portable GFCI unit and avoid any issues with altering your current home wiring.

Do you have four 10-ga wires running to the outlet, or three? Either way can work with the spa panel, but with four you have the ability to safely power both 240V and 120V devices in your brewery. With three you will only be able to power 240V devices, and will need to run a separate circuit to the brewery for 120V. If you only have three and it is easy to run new 10-ga wire from the panel to the outlet, I would consider doing it with four.
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Old 08-17-2012, 10:54 AM   #17
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Yes. You use the spa panel to obtain GFCI protection, and if you fit it with a male plug to go into your permanently installed outlet (rather than hardwiring) you have a portable GFCI unit and avoid any issues with altering your current home wiring.

Do you have four 10-ga wires running to the outlet, or three? Either way can work with the spa panel, but with four you have the ability to safely power both 240V and 120V devices in your brewery. With three you will only be able to power 240V devices, and will need to run a separate circuit to the brewery for 120V. If you only have three and it is easy to run new 10-ga wire from the panel to the outlet, I would consider doing it with four.
I believe I only have 10/3 since all the 240V outlets in my house are 3 prong outlets. To be completely honest, I'm not even sure if the electrician took out the existing 10 gauge wire and replaced it with something smaller to install those 120V outlets. Whatever the case is, I'm sure I could run 10/3 wire with ground if the electrician was able to do it.
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Originally Posted by BierMuncher View Post

“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:17 PM   #18
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Now time for some electrical porn

Here is what my breaker panel looks without its cover:





Does that bottom right look like 10 gauge to you all? More importantly, does it look like this will work for 120V applications?

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Originally Posted by BierMuncher View Post

“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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Old 08-20-2012, 11:15 PM   #19
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On the meantime I'm figuring out the electric schematics of my project, I have gotten my metal ready to weld my brew stand. Cant wait

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BierMuncher View Post

“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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Old 08-21-2012, 03:16 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Will_M

Am I correct in seeing white/neutral wires being used as load wires off the breakers in this panel?
I'm not entirely sure... Maybe someone here might know?


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Quote:
Originally Posted by BierMuncher View Post

“Get your beer off the yeast cake on day 7 or your beer will crawl out of the fermenter and eat your youngest child”

“Your beer will be the equivalent of rhinoceros urine unless it sits on the primary yeast cake for at least 4 weeks.”
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