Electric Brewing Supply 30A BCS Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Electric Brewing > BCS460 electric build from square one
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-31-2012, 05:46 PM   #21
Bsquared
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Bsquared's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,812
Liked 55 Times on 51 Posts
Likes Given: 22

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shroomzofdoom View Post

I've realized it also helps to have the pumps well below all vessels so that gravity can prime the pumps when the kettle valve is opened--for the most part this can push air bubbles past the impeller. Stuck sparges are a real pain with diptubes especially in the last 3 gallons
Three things that has helped me to stop having this problem are for all my batches I toss in 1lb of rice hulls on top of the false bottom before adding my grains. I dough in from the bottom, or pump strike water in through the mash outlet. Finally when I start the pump for re-circulation I only open the valve a 1/4 to 1/2 open to prevent the grain bed from collapsing and sticking. Come to think of it, I never open my mash valve fully after I dough in.
__________________
Bsquared is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 03:49 AM   #22
Holter
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Culver City, Ca
Posts: 117
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shroomzofdoom View Post
Good point, I hadn't even thought of this. I know there are lots of variables like water volume, etc--but how much time would you say this adds to a brewday?
.
It shouldn't add any time. Let's say your mash needed 6 gallons of strike water and your sparge required 8 gallons. Your total would be 14 gallons. With this system you would just put 6 gallons in the mash tun and 8 gallons in the HLT. Start heating up and then you are good to go - either way you are going to heat up your 14 gallons. With a Herms system you would have your HLT at temp anyway because you are recirculating. In fact, if anything it will save you time.
__________________
Holter is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 04:08 AM   #23
mateomtb
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pine, Co
Posts: 122
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
Ok, so I just wanted to include B_K's method as option 3.
..................
A lot of this decision would depend on where you're putting your 50a of available juice. If I went option 1 or 3, I'd put two 5500w elements into the HLT and one in the BK with a switch for HLT=11kW or HLT=5500w + BK=5500w. If I've got 50a to play with, I always want it maximized to cut time off brewday.
This is how I've been looking at it too, busy life = I'll buy time anywhere I can. I am putting 2 elements in the HLT and the BK. 1 in each vessel I plan for holding temps/boil, the other 2 used as a quick heat boost to cut down wait times. I do also have the option of running all 4 at the same time for even more time savings going back to back which I think would be the common use case. At least that's my plan.
__________________
mateomtb is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 11:43 AM   #24
blakeseven
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: manassas, va
Posts: 68
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

I like the idea of 11Kw in both the boil kettle & HL. My question is will a 60 amp service allow me to have 4- 5.5 Kw elements and 2 pumps working at the same time? Second, how would you wire this ? SSR on one leg of each?

Thanks

__________________
blakeseven is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 12:47 PM   #25
Bobby_M
Vendor and Brewer
HBT_SPONSOR.png
Vendor Ads 
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Bobby_M's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Whitehouse Station, NJ
Posts: 22,097
Liked 1009 Times on 675 Posts
Likes Given: 28

Default

Oh, no way. 11Kw is the limit for a 50a run with very little to spare for pumps.

__________________
BrewHardware.com
Sightglass, Refractometer, Ball Valve, Weldless bulkhead, Thermometer, Decals, Stainless Steel Fittings, Compression Fittings, Camlock Quick Disconnects, Scale, RIMS tube, Plate Chiller, Chugger Pump, Super Clear Silicone Tubing, and more!

New Stuff?
Bobby_M is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 03:17 PM   #26
mateomtb
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pine, Co
Posts: 122
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blakeseven View Post
I like the idea of 11Kw in both the boil kettle & HL. My question is will a 60 amp service allow me to have 4- 5.5 Kw elements and 2 pumps working at the same time? Second, how would you wire this ? SSR on one leg of each?

Thanks
Yeah, what bobby_m said. I should have pointed out I have 100amps of service available at my control panel. I may never run 4 at a time though, more likely 3 and the more I think about it mostly 2.

To me a flexible setup would be to have 2 in each vessel for a total of 4. Then have selector switches wired like this.

hlt element 1 <- switch 1 -> boil element 1
hlt element 2 <- switch 2 -> boil element 2

So then you could choose to mix and match the use of your 2 elements as you please.

I'm pretty sure PJ has a diagram out there similar to this, but I think it's drawn like this. I think I saved it somewhere I'll look for it when I have time.

hlt 2 elements on <- switch -> boil 2 elements on
__________________
mateomtb is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-01-2012, 04:38 PM   #27
blakeseven
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: manassas, va
Posts: 68
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Would love to see PJ's diagram. That makes for a lot of flexibility. Will I be able to have 3 elements and 2 pumps running on a 60 amp service?

__________________
blakeseven is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-02-2012, 12:13 AM   #28
mateomtb
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pine, Co
Posts: 122
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blakeseven View Post
Would love to see PJ's diagram. That makes for a lot of flexibility. Will I be able to have 3 elements and 2 pumps running on a 60 amp service?
No that won't work. Keep poking around here and you'll start figuring out what you need to know, like GFCI etc. Here are some basic numbers. Start adding stuff up and you see where you run out of capacity.

5500 w element = 22.9 amp x 3 = More than 60
You get the idea.

PJ's drawing isn't with a BCS but this is the diagram I remember seeing. Lots of good info in that thread as he evolved the drawing.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/con...35/index8.html
__________________
mateomtb is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2012, 01:03 PM   #29
shroomzofdoom
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Piscataway, NJ
Posts: 609
Liked 11 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default A few gratuitous pics while I wait for a shipment..

My control panel is going to be pretty similar to this one (Credit to P-J of course) If anyone has a P-J diagram with two elements for the HLT and BK, lemme know. I like the flexibility aspect of it, but something tells me that ANYTHING is going to be a step up from where I am at today. I brewed yesterday and kinda hated it--I have to build the rig for my sanity...too many wires on brewday; too much transferring of fluids and stepping over stuff. Oh, and did I mention how much I hate diptubes as well? Bottom drain-FTW.

This is a simple, clean photo of recirc during heating up the strike--but it sure looked like a mess about 20 mins later.


For anyone curious what a heat curve looks like for 2x2000w elements (input voltage is usually around 118). This is for 6 gallons from about 50-172, sampling 30 sec intervals. It took 33 mins. The blip at the front of the curve is before I hooked up the pump to recirc.


Temporary control panel; one ziploc, one rubber band--all business. I am only using the BCS for monitoring and logging right now, just started to build my processes. No control at this point, but having fun learning with it.


Oh and I think I found why I hated my pumps, one works flawlessly--one always broke siphon and had noisy operation. Inspected the impeller and found it to have a QC issue, contacted manufacturer for RMA. These are REALLY sensitive; it's only off 1mm and the pump is virtually unusable.

__________________
Mike D

My electric BCS-460 build (work in progress)

Coffin cooling lessons
shroomzofdoom is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-20-2012, 05:44 PM   #30
prrriiide
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Smokin cigarettes and watching Captain Kangaroo
Posts: 610
Liked 16 Times on 14 Posts
Likes Given: 8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
I used to think that a HERMS was a waste of energy because it had to see the HLT full of hot water the whole mash but with a little insulation, it doesn't take much energy to hold temp for a mere hour. It also takes away that moment of occasional panic when you realized you forgot to start heating your sparge water in time.
Bobby, I saw a rig this past weekend that used an insulated institutional-sized veggie can as the heat source for the HERMS. Basically, he had a 2200w 120v heating element through the bottom of the can, which had a copper coil and less than a gallon of water in it. On the top of the can were the tube fittings and the line from the PID controller, and a PC fan with a long bolt attached to it. The bolt had a wing nut on it to act as an agitator to keep the water moving around in the can. It took really very little energy to hold his mash temp because he wasn't heating a whole lot of water with it, and he was brewing outside at low-40* temps. He just kept the mash recirculating through the coil in the the little can.

HLT and BK were direct-fired.
__________________
It seemed like a good idea at the time...
prrriiide is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Electric Brewery Build! jbsengineer Electric Brewing 185 07-26-2012 07:18 PM
My electric build. ikonis Electric Brewing 17 03-30-2012 02:09 PM
electric build help nootay Electric Brewing 2 08-25-2011 04:45 PM
New Electric Build eric_pwb Electric Brewing 19 03-10-2011 08:03 PM
Three E's Electric Brewery Build EuBrew Electric Brewing 54 01-08-2011 07:11 AM