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Old Yesterday, 08:04 PM   #91
KevinP
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Originally Posted by augiedoggy View Post
I had a feeling you would say that...

Well that defeats the purpose for many using electric systems.... One of the key reasons for going electric in my case was to eliminate the restrictions of a gas flame system and for consistent results...


So the question remains for those with a complete electric brew system, Is there a 220v ulwd element that will not rust to use for the boil kettle?

cleaning the base of the element works between brews but it would be nice not to have to worry about it.
But an electric boil would eliminate the fun of playing with FIRE

Do people have consistency issues with fire?

I didn't think lwd was necessary for the boil. RIMS and direct mash heating sure but for boil? I haven't looked into it much so I digress and will continue playing with FIRE
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Old Yesterday, 10:00 PM   #92
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Fwiw, my bk element is a camco and I have no problems with it at all. It gets the hop crud cleaned after brewing and then stored dry.
Yes but arent the camco elements ultra low watt density? is your element silver or dark gray? the dark gray ones are ulwd and are much less likely to scortch the wort. The regular element surface is hotter than the ulwd making it easy to burn if the wort isnt constantly moving over the surface.
I will never go back to fire again if I can help it... I can control the boil perfectly with my electric setup as well as the rate of evaporation.. plus I brew in my house in a spare bedroom.... Not a smart Idea with an outdoor propane burner.. temps make a huge difference in the beer... if the boil is too vigouruos you get too much evap not vigorous enough and not enough hop utilization.
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Old Yesterday, 10:20 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by augiedoggy View Post
Yes but arent the camco elements ultra low watt density? is your element silver or dark gray? the dark gray ones are ulwd and are much less likely to scortch the wort. The regular element surface is hotter than the ulwd making it easy to burn if the wort isnt constantly moving over the surface.
I will never go back to fire again if I can help it... I can control the boil perfectly with my electric setup as well as the rate of evaporation.. plus I brew in my house in a spare bedroom.... Not a smart Idea with an outdoor propane burner.. temps make a huge difference in the beer... if the boil is too vigouruos you get too much evap not vigorous enough and not enough hop utilization.
The 'dark gray' I believe you are referring to is not indicative of watt density but is caused by annealing of the incoloy stainless, to make it pliable for bending. Camco uses a 'full anneal' process which send the entire element through an oven with an atmosphere. This anneals the entire assembly instead of just the bending area (like with BREWHA elements). The annealing creates an oxidized layer of something similar to chromium oxide or nickel oxide (although I am told the makeup of this layer is different than the spot anneal which is done in regular air). It also makes the surface slightly less smooth so that it is slightly harder to clean. For applications where cleaning the element between uses is desirable, this layer is not helpful and is better if minimized. The perfectly shiny elements are often coated after bending.

Watt density is determined by the total output, relative to the surface area of the heating sheath (length of the heating element*diameter*3.14). Take the total output of the heating element (at a given voltage) and divide it by its surface area. BREWHA elements are designed to be as low as, or lower watt density than the ULWD Camco elements.
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Old Yesterday, 10:47 PM   #94
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The 'dark gray' I believe you are referring to is not indicative of watt density but is caused by annealing of the incoloy stainless, to make it pliable for bending. Camco uses a 'full anneal' process which send the entire element through an oven with an atmosphere. This anneals the entire assembly instead of just the bending area (like with BREWHA elements). The annealing creates an oxidized layer of something similar to chromium oxide or nickel oxide (although I am told the makeup of this layer is different than the spot anneal which is done in regular air). It also makes the surface slightly less smooth so that it is slightly harder to clean. For applications where cleaning the element between uses is desirable, this layer is not helpful and is better if minimized. The perfectly shiny elements are often coated after bending.

Watt density is determined by the total output, relative to the surface area of the heating sheath (length of the heating element*diameter*3.14). Take the total output of the heating element (at a given voltage) and divide it by its surface area. BREWHA elements are designed to be as low as, or lower watt density than the ULWD Camco elements.
I stand corrected...with that said all the "dark gray" ones Ive seem to come across have been advertised as low watt or ultra low watt and I have yet to see a shiny silver ultra low watt density one so I made an incorrect assumption....I was also under the assuption the dull dark surface resisted mineral buildup better than the other surfaces and this was related.
my units are the long ripple elements and while my boil kettle element doesnt seem to rust at the base my HLT does..
Does this change the Other point I was making about the shorter non ultra low watt density ones being hotter at the surface where they contact the wort?
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Old Yesterday, 11:38 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by augiedoggy View Post
I stand corrected...with that said all the "dark gray" ones Ive seem to come across have been advertised as low watt or ultra low watt and I have yet to see a shiny silver ultra low watt density one so I made an incorrect assumption....I was also under the assuption the dull dark surface resisted mineral buildup better than the other surfaces and this was related.
my units are the long ripple elements and while my boil kettle element doesnt seem to rust at the base my HLT does..
Does this change the Other point I was making about the shorter non ultra low watt density ones being hotter at the surface where they contact the wort?
Yes, a shorter element with a given diameter and wattage will be hotter at the surface than a longer element with the same diameter and wattage as the heat generated will be dissipated through a smaller surface area and be more intense.
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Old Today, 05:54 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by augiedoggy View Post
I had a feeling you would say that...



Well that defeats the purpose for many using electric systems.... One of the key reasons for going electric in my case was to eliminate the restrictions of a gas flame system and for consistent results...





So the question remains for those with a complete electric brew system, Is there a 220v ulwd element that will not rust to use for the boil kettle?



cleaning the base of the element works between brews but it would be nice not to have to worry about it.

Just the brewmation one as far as I know. Otherwise coat the base of the camco with high temp NSF silicone as many have done without ever getting rust.
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