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-   -   GF Tripel Recipe (http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f164/gf-tripel-recipe-168327/)

DKershner 03-15-2010 04:33 PM

GF Tripel Recipe
 
Dorklord asked me some questions in PMs, then his inbox was full, so I thought I would just post it here, since you guys can probably help anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dorklord
Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner
Quote:

Originally Posted by dorklord
I noticed in one of your posts, you mentioned a GF Belgian Tripel, I'd be interested in what the recipe on that was. Belgian beers were my favorites I'm aiming to try a Tripel and a belgian witbier if I can find a good recipe (in other words, one that comes with a recommendation from someone who's actually drank it!) and the ingredients (still haven't found my GF brown rice syrup...)
Thanks,

Chris

http://brew.dkershner.com/2009/gluten-free-tripel-blonde/

You can see my tasting notes and what I would do better next time. I would also use white labs belgian yeast if you (or the consumer) can handle 2ppm gluten.

For the record, I think the wit will come out better. Easy to hide sorghum with coriander and orange peel.

Well, my favorite tripel actually has coriander in it, so I figured I'd toss some in...So, are you saying you'd use the Trappist High Gravity yeast? And for rice syrup and sugar, about how much would you use? I've heard some people say too much plain sugar will result in a 'cidery' taste, and I've been wondering if the sorghum flavor sort of 'blends' with that or if I should spring for candi sugar.

I'm probably going to order (or find) some rice syrup/rice solids (I wonder if the rice solids from midwest or NB are GF?) for this, since I've probably got another week before I transfer my non-GF tripel to the secondary...

I wouldn't worry too much about a cidery taste. There are some people who have experimented in this forum with 50%+ to no cidery taste. Candi sugar really wouldn't help anyway, but imparts a slightly different flavor. I wouldn't worry about it.

Trappist high gravity is my favorite belgian yeast, but id use the wit for the wit. Make sure you are getting White labs not Wyeast.

No idea about the rice solids...or what those are. You can always ask them, NB has good customer service.

dorklord 03-15-2010 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner (Post 1945432)
Dorklord asked me some questions in PMs, then his inbox was full, so I thought I would just post it here, since you guys can probably help anyway.



I wouldn't worry too much about a cidery taste. There are some people who have experimented in this forum with 50%+ to no cidery taste. Candi sugar really wouldn't help anyway, but imparts a slightly different flavor. I wouldn't worry about it.

Trappist high gravity is my favorite belgian yeast, but id use the wit for the wit. Make sure you are getting White labs not Wyeast.

No idea about the rice solids...or what those are. You can always ask them, NB has good customer service.

Apparently rice syrup solids is fully dried rice syrup, sort of like DME vs LME.

I guess for some reason I thought I had read that wyeast was low in gluten, but I must have been confusing that with white labs.

So, It sounds like a ratio of 5 or 1 to one, sorghum to rice, is a good start, and roughly how much would you increase the sugar?

Right now, I'm thinking:

6 lbs of Sorghum syrup
1 lb rice syrup
3 lbs of sugar (corn sugar)
1 oz coriander
?? Malto dextrin
Some yeast nutrient (just to be sure)

And then I'll hops per your Tripel recipe. I think I'll probably spring for the white labs trappist yeast, I was a little worried about the shipping of the liquid yeast, but I was told not to worry (have a home brew...) and just put it in the fridge when I get it.

jjp36 03-15-2010 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner (Post 1945432)
Trappist high gravity is my favorite belgian yeast, but id use the wit for the wit. Make sure you are getting White labs not Wyeast.

Are you sure about this? I think the Wyeast high gravity is the westmalle strain, i have used it in several belgian dark strongs and tripels, some of which have won awards.

I think you're confusing the Wyeast Trappist High Gravity (Wyeast 3787) and the White Labs super high gravity (WLP099). In which case I'm guessing you meant "Make sure you're getting wyeast and not white labs"

dorklord 03-15-2010 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjp36 (Post 1945545)
Are you sure about this? I think the Wyeast high gravity is the westmalle strain, i have used it in several belgian dark strongs and tripels, some of which have won awards.

I think you're confusing the Wyeast Trappist High Gravity (Wyeast 3787) and the White Labs super high gravity (WLP099). In which case I'm guessing you meant "Make sure you're getting wyeast and not white labs"

I think he is saying to get white labs because of the gluten. I had thought that wyeast was the ones who had low gluten in their liquid yeasts, but after he mentioned that, I went back and looked, and every reference I could find was to white labs saying their yeast is < 12 ppm in the slurry, nothing from wyeast (other than that at some point they had made a gluten free liquid yeast, but it appears to be unavailable now).

DKershner 03-15-2010 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dorklord (Post 1945566)
I think he is saying to get white labs because of the gluten. I had thought that wyeast was the ones who had low gluten in their liquid yeasts, but after he mentioned that, I went back and looked, and every reference I could find was to white labs saying their yeast is < 12 ppm in the slurry, nothing from wyeast (other than that at some point they had made a gluten free liquid yeast, but it appears to be unavailable now).

All correct. ~12ppm in the slurry or ~2ppm in the final product. 2ppm is below the European standard for "Gluten-free". No such standard yet exists in the US.

For gluten-free: Dry > White labs >>>>>>> Wyeast.

There is also a dry yeast you can try called 'Brewferm Blanche'. I have never tried it nor have I tried to confirm it is Gluten free, but I think it is Belgian style.

DKershner 03-15-2010 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dorklord (Post 1945542)
Apparently rice syrup solids is fully dried rice syrup, sort of like DME vs LME.

I guess for some reason I thought I had read that wyeast was low in gluten, but I must have been confusing that with white labs.

So, It sounds like a ratio of 5 or 1 to one, sorghum to rice, is a good start, and roughly how much would you increase the sugar?

Right now, I'm thinking:

6 lbs of Sorghum syrup
1 lb rice syrup
3 lbs of sugar (corn sugar)
1 oz coriander
?? Malto dextrin
Some yeast nutrient (just to be sure)

And then I'll hops per your Tripel recipe. I think I'll probably spring for the white labs trappist yeast, I was a little worried about the shipping of the liquid yeast, but I was told not to worry (have a home brew...) and just put it in the fridge when I get it.

Order the liquid yeast while it is still cold out. ;)

Those sugars put you at about 1.069, i'd bump up one of em to get you 1.075+.

1oz coriander is A LOT. That's fine if you love the taste, or plan to age a long time, but I would go with less.

No malto dextrin necessary, Tripels can be pretty dry. If you want a bit more body/sweetness, toss in an ounce or two at any time in the process.

As for sorghum to rice ratios...the rice syrup is basically just sugar, but imparts a different flavor. I would just use a sugar vs extract ratio instead, and 6:4 is a fine one, I'd wouldn't be afraid of 6:5...though I am afraid when you get near 50%. Some others have tried it with success though.

dorklord 03-15-2010 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner (Post 1945627)
Order the liquid yeast while it is still cold out. ;)

Those sugars put you at about 1.069, i'd bump up one of em to get you 1.075+.

1oz coriander is A LOT. That's fine if you love the taste, or plan to age a long time, but I would go with less.

No malto dextrin necessary, Tripels can be pretty dry. If you want a bit more body/sweetness, toss in an ounce or two at any time in the process.

As for sorghum to rice ratios...the rice syrup is basically just sugar, but imparts a different flavor. I would just use a sugar vs extract ratio instead, and 6:4 is a fine one, I'd wouldn't be afraid of 6:5...though I am afraid when you get near 50%. Some others have tried it with success though.

I don't have my OG calc handy, but I think another quarter pound of corn sugar (I'm adding more sugar because I'm only ordering 1 lb of rice syrup) should put me at 1.078. I used the 1 oz amount of coriander because that's what goes in the belgian wit recipe I've got and that's the size they sell it in, but I was actually thinking that I'd use less, maybe a quarter or half of that. I like the Tripel I drank before I got diagnosed with Celiacs, (New Belgian) and I also like the various belgian witbiers I've had (which all have coriander and bitter orange) but I don't know for sure how much they actually use, I'm guessing less in the Tripel than the witbier. I figure the Tripel probably will have to age for a while, but I'm hoping it can be done quicker than the 3 months my non-gf Tripel says it will take!

I've seen a few posts saying that malto dextrin is the 'magic ingredient' for giving GF beers body and head (and I guess alcohol is the soul :cross: ) though I'm sure the amount varies based on the 'type' of beer. Since this is a tripel, I don't want it to be too heavy, but I also don't want it to be too dry and to lack head, so I figured I'd toss in an ounce and see how it goes.

DKershner 03-15-2010 08:34 PM

If you do want to speed the process along, forget what I said about upping the OG. More alcohol = more aging. For something in the 1.08 range, malty, and has some spice in it, I would think 6 months - 1 year would be ideal. Of course, you can do whatever you like, it's your beer! :mug: You might save a couple though.

1oz coriander in a 5gal wit is pronounced, but not overpowering. I would think you would want something less than that in a tripel.

Maltodextrin does near nothing for head, or head retention. It might if there was soemthing there to begin with... All it really does is add body and sweetness. Use accordingly!

dorklord 03-16-2010 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner (Post 1946115)
If you do want to speed the process along, forget what I said about upping the OG. More alcohol = more aging. For something in the 1.08 range, malty, and has some spice in it, I would think 6 months - 1 year would be ideal. Of course, you can do whatever you like, it's your beer! :mug: You might save a couple though.

1oz coriander in a 5gal wit is pronounced, but not overpowering. I would think you would want something less than that in a tripel.

Maltodextrin does near nothing for head, or head retention. It might if there was soemthing there to begin with... All it really does is add body and sweetness. Use accordingly!

Well, since this is going to be my first GF brew...I don't want to wait too long. If it needs to age for 6 months, I doubt much of it will last that long. I know I want less than 1 oz in the Tripel, I'm just not sure how much...I'm thinkin a quarter to half an ounce. Then I'll have a little left for the next batch (which will probably be Wit, and will probably involve doing something to buckwheat or millet).

Lcasanova 03-16-2010 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkershner (Post 1946115)
Maltodextrin does near nothing for head, or head retention. It might if there was soemthing there to begin with... All it really does is add body and sweetness. Use accordingly!

I've noticed this as well and since it doesn't seem to do what I want I sometimes forget to add it. Every now and then I get a beer with fantastic head though!


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