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-   -   Wyeast 1762 and fusel alcohol (http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/wyeast-1762-fusel-alcohol-323599/)

djbradle 04-24-2012 12:17 AM

Wyeast 1762 and fusel alcohol
 
So I did the NB number eight kit back in late Dec.'11 when the kit used D-45 instead of soft brown sugar as they have in their kits now. I have a problem with this yeast strain throwing nasty fusel alcohols and I mean hot. I've seen from some users of this strain that anything around the low 70 ferm temp is doomed to have unmitigated fusels. I have this problem after several months of conditioning and I know it won't go away for a loooong time, if ever. I fermented this in an ambient 68 degress and the exothermic temp could have been in the lower 70's I suppose but wow what a hot bomb. If not for the fusel it would be very very nice but I am disappointed.

Anyone keep this in the lower to mid 60's and have a nice result?

I figure I might be better off culturing yeast from my Rochefort 10 sitting in storage for my next clone of it rather than try 1762 again.Whaddya think?

djbradle 04-24-2012 12:54 AM

Turns out after some research the culturing may not work with high abv and long storage times.

afr0byte 04-24-2012 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djbradle (Post 4023033)
Turns out after some research the culturing may not work with high abv and long storage times.

"the culturing"? Anyways, yeah, you want fresh yeast, and a lot of it, for beer like that.

djbradle 04-24-2012 01:38 AM

Yes, culturing: the propagation of microorganisms or of living tissue cells in media conducive to their growth.

And I'm quite aware of the need for fresh yeast and alot of it at that. When you culture yeast from a bottle you build up that small population to make a viable pitching starter up to 5 step ups in most cases depending on the cell count needed for proper attenuation.

afr0byte 04-24-2012 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djbradle (Post 4023162)
Yes, culturing: the propagation of microorganisms or of living tissue cells in media conducive to their growth.

And I'm quite aware of the need for fresh yeast and alot of it at that. When you culture yeast from a bottle you build up that small population to make a viable pitching starter up to 5 step ups in most cases depending on the cell count needed for proper attenuation.

Well, duh. I certainly know what culturing is, in general. I didn't know what you meant by the culturing, though.

afr0byte 04-24-2012 01:53 AM

Anyways, yes, you shouldn't propagate yeast from a high abv commercial beer, as you found out. As far as the Rochefort yeast--I recently did a tripel (1.080) with it. I did a little over a liter of starter wort, in to which I pitched 2 smack packs. I stirred that on a stir plate. I started my ferment at about 65 an slowly ramped it up over about 5 days (I have a temperature controller that does both heating and cooling) to 72-73. I didn't get any fusels. I can definitely taste a bit of ethanol (The beer is 9.1% after all...and the yeast is known for a slight ethanol flavor component.).

zachattack 04-24-2012 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djbradle (Post 4022900)
I fermented this in an ambient 68 degress and the exothermic temp could have been in the lower 70's I suppose but wow what a hot bomb. If not for the fusel it would be very very nice but I am disappointed.

Anyone keep this in the lower to mid 60's and have a nice result?

Per Jamil's advice in BCS, I aimed for a start of 68 and slowly ramped up to 72 over a few days for my Belgian Dark Strong. I have a small "fermentation chamber" (light bulb heater in cardboard box w/ temp controller) that I used after the first few days. I pitched the yeast at about 65, by the next morning it was at 68 and it held there for a couple days before I needed to turn on the heater.

This was in a glass carboy placed in an empty plastic tub placed in a 55 degree closet. So some insulation, but not a lot.

My point is, ff your ambient was 68 your beer was probably 75-80 degrees.

djbradle 04-24-2012 05:04 AM

afr0byte and zachattack thank you for your input and experience. No doubt I must have been in the upper 70's and maybe in the 80's then. I have no good temp controller to speak of and I figure if the fermometer says 68-70 then next time I must add 10 onto that for a violent belgian yeast like 1762 and wlp575. I recently did a bsda with the wlp 575 that was started around 68 ( est. internal temp) for the first three days then ramped up to 74 or so and it came out wonderful with fruity ester and some spicy phenols. More leniency I guess.

bbrim 04-24-2012 05:37 AM

I have a Belgian Brown ale (I know it's not a real style) in secondary right now. I used 1762 in it. Fermentation was 64-65. I got plum flavors from the hydrometer sample. Super delicious, I mean I am in love with the beer. One of the very best, most expressive beers I have ever made. Ferment cooler next time, make a big started and get some oxygen in there. Give that yeast everything it needs to reach the ivy league.

DannPM 04-24-2012 07:22 AM

I've never had much luck making a pants dropping awesome beer with 1762, decent, but nothing like I can get from 3787.

I swear those Rochefort monks are magic or 1782 is a widely mutated from the lab propagation. I know Rochefort has some interesting procedures vs standard breweries though with regard to yeast.


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