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Old 06-19-2011, 05:24 PM   #1
kennywd
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Default Stalled Stout

I have a Chocolate Stout that was in Primary for 7 Days, OG was 1.061 and after Secondary and the for 2 weeks its stayed at 1.031. I tried to re-pitch Champagne yeast, but have no idea if this will help or not. I don't really know the signs if its working should i see the same effects as primary fermentation? This is my second brew and first higher gravity brew. Any input would be great. Short form its been in primary for a week and secondary for 2 weeks and no gravity change. Thank you for who ever reads this. I am sure next time I will try a yeast Starter cause that is were I believe I went wrong.

TYPE: Extract

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 4.01 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 39.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 5.3 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
2 lbs 7.2 oz Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM) Dry Extract 5 27.4 %
5 lbs 6.2 oz Dark Liquid Extract (17.5 SRM) Extract 4 60.2 %
14.5 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 1 10.1 %
0.5 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 0.0 %
3.2 oz Oats, Steal Cut (1.0 SRM) Grain 2 2.2 %
0.43 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 5.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Irish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1084) [125.00 ml Yeast 8 -

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Old 06-19-2011, 05:31 PM   #2
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Yeah, I always say this to new brewers, before getting into high gravity learn how to wrangle yeast or you will have a bad day. As you noted you underpitched, a starter in the ballpark of 1.5 liters is what you would want for that (off the top of my head). Next, you removed the beer from the yeast way too soon. Many seasoned homebrewers have moved away from secondaries except for certain cases (fruiting, bulk aging for months on end, lambics) so leaving the beer on the yeast would have helped push down the gravity further. You also want to consider your temp, you want stability or you can crash out your yeast. Proper wort oxygenation and quality yeast nutrients will also be a big help. Finally, make sure you are using fresh yeast, if that smack pack was 3 months old you really are fighting an uphill battle without a starter and proper yeast care.

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Old 06-19-2011, 05:54 PM   #3
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Thank you for the speedy reply. So basically your saying you would have left your beer on primary for how long normally? The Entire time or just part of the time? My Temperature is normally at a constant 68 degs via swamp cooling and water bath, so I know that's good. I thought I should had done a yeast starter like you said..next time I know. Any ideas one what I can do to save this brew?

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Old 06-19-2011, 06:14 PM   #4
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I leave my ales, or brews with ale yeast, in primary until they're done. NO racking to another vessel after a week just because some nut (or the stinking kit sheet) said to. IME, leaving the brew in primary, on the yeast cake, has resulted in great brews. Of course, moving to all grain didn't hurt either. Especially since I now control the mash temp, and the FG destination of the wort. Not the company that produced the extract.

Search a bit and you'll see a good number of threads where people, brewing with extract, cannot get below 1.020 for the FG, no matter what the recipe should have hit.

If champagne yeast doesn't do anything to bring down the SG closer to your goal, then I would say it's done. Means that all the sugars that the yeast could consume, has been converted into alcohol, and you're not going to get anything more from the wort.

BTW, I have used Wyeast 1084, and it does really well, normally. Leaving the wort on it for a solid month wouldn't have done any harm. I had a brew sit on it for 6 weeks, with zero ill effects. IMO, you can safely go a couple of months, or longer (there are enough people that have left the brew in primary for 6+ months here) without issue. Of course, maintaining temps during the important times matters... 68F is fine for 1084 too, so I don't think that has anything to do with the issue here.

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Old 06-20-2011, 12:06 AM   #5
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Like Golddiggie said, nothing much you can do that you haven't done already. Let the champagne yeast try to do what its going to do. The good thing though is now you know that secondary bucket is mostly useless so you can go ahead and use it for a primary to have two brews fermenting at the same time.

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Old 06-20-2011, 12:35 AM   #6
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Champagne yeast won't do much to help attenuate a stuck beer. Wine yeast has been selected to eat fruit sugars not maltose, and the simple sugars were knocked out by the 1084 right off the bat. What champagne yeast is good for is bottle conditioning because of its neutral flavor and alcohol tolerance. If you're wanting to salvage this brew you should make up a starter of something like 1056, wlp099, or pacman if you can find it. Pitch that while it's at high krausen. Adding yeast mid ferment is pretty stressful so you'll want to make sure the starter's really rocking when you dump it in. Or you could always jump over to the wild side and toss in some brett.

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Old 06-20-2011, 12:51 AM   #7
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Well thanks for all the help I will wait for any sign of the yeast working. Since I pitched will it go though same type of fermentation as primary? Either way I was going to bottle in about a week, but figured I should wait an extra week. As far as priming goes be aide of the higher gravity will that change the amount of priming sugars. I would guess no, but asking to not screw anything else up.

Also I hate asking newbie questions, but sometime finding this information is hard to find for a specific issue. Again thanks.

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Old 06-20-2011, 04:59 AM   #8
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Yeah, I'm going to really have to agree with Pohldogg on this one, champagne is really a hope and a prayer and won't give you the character you were hoping for.

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Old 06-21-2011, 04:43 AM   #9
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OK so here is the thing, I think I will just cut my losses and go ahead and bottle on the schedule date I had this Sat. Thing is because of our only Brew shop being closed most of the week and even if I shipped in supplies a starter wont be ready.. As you can figure the champagne yeast didn't save me.

My question is will it be a bad idea to bottle? Its been sitting 4 weeks total. Gravity was at 1.031 I will check again on bottling date but I doubt I will have much change. I only had slight fermentation (barely any from what I could tell).

Last thing I want is Bottles blowing up in my face. So this will prolly be the last question on this brew. I will just learn from what not to do.. and do what I need for next time.

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Old 06-21-2011, 06:06 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kennywd View Post
I have a Chocolate Stout that was in Primary for 7 Days, OG was 1.061 and after Secondary and the for 2 weeks its stayed at 1.031. I tried to re-pitch Champagne yeast, but have no idea if this will help or not. I don't really know the signs if its working should i see the same effects as primary fermentation? This is my second brew and first higher gravity brew. Any input would be great. Short form its been in primary for a week and secondary for 2 weeks and no gravity change. Thank you for who ever reads this. I am sure next time I will try a yeast Starter cause that is were I believe I went wrong.

TYPE: Extract

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 4.01 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 39.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 5.3 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
2 lbs 7.2 oz Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM) Dry Extract 5 27.4 %
5 lbs 6.2 oz Dark Liquid Extract (17.5 SRM) Extract 4 60.2 %
14.5 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 1 10.1 %
0.5 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 0.0 %
3.2 oz Oats, Steal Cut (1.0 SRM) Grain 2 2.2 %
0.43 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 5.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Irish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1084) [125.00 ml Yeast 8 -
I made a double chocolate coffee stout (extract) using dry yeast S04. OG was about 70 and it stuck after 3 weeks at 36. I too tried the Champagne yeast and it did little. It went down to 34. Bottled it a week later and it should be ready this Sat after 3 weeks at 70*.
Next time I'll use an AG BIAB set up.

Do let us know the final outcome.
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