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Old 09-25-2012, 08:51 PM   #1
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Default Safale-05 vs. Saflager-23 fermented at 50-55 degrees

I am beginning to plan for winter brewing when my basement temperature will dip to 50-55 degrees. Based on the Fermentis website, that is too cold for US-05, but it is perfect for S-23. I am not looking to make a true lager, but what would happen if I used S-23 on an IPA or amber ale fermented at say 55 degrees, instead of the US-05, which I would normally use during the rest of the year and ferment at 65-70 degrees?

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Old 09-25-2012, 11:07 PM   #2
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It would make beer. Assuming you did all the other nuances it takes to make lager yeast work.

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Old 09-26-2012, 01:38 AM   #3
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Assuming you did all the other nuances it takes to make lager yeast work.
I guess that is my question--if I do not do all of the other nuances (e.g. a D-rest) but ferment at 55, as opposed to 68, will I end up with a "steam" beer, a "clean" ale, or something else? (I recognize that I will not get a true lager, but I am not seeking a lager as I will be using a traditional ale, not a lager recipe.)
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Old 09-26-2012, 01:50 AM   #4
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I guess that is my question--if I do not do all of the other nuances (e.g. a D-rest) but ferment at 55, as opposed to 68, will I end up with a "steam" beer, a "clean" ale, or something else? (I recognize that I will not get a true lager, but I am not seeking a lager as I will be using a traditional ale, not a lager recipe.)
You'll still get a "true" lager with S-23, since it's a lager yeast. It'd only be a steam beer if you fermented at ale temps (50-55 is roughly the lager fermentation range).
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:19 AM   #5
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You will have an unfinished, unlagered lager.

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Old 09-26-2012, 11:25 AM   #6
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You will have an unfinished, unlagered lager.
Well, if you're saying he'll need a d-rest, that isn't necessarily the case. Unlagered...that's true.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:29 AM   #7
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Well, if you're saying he'll need a d-rest, that isn't necessarily the case. Unlagered...that's true.
Not sure what the OP is wanting but it appears he wants to use a lager yeast at lager temperature with an ale timeline which IMO will never work unless making a steam or something similar. Lagers take 3 times the duration of an ale just to ferment in my experience, however I tend to ferment lagers around 45F.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:39 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by COLObrewer View Post
Not sure what the OP is wanting but it appears he wants to use a lager yeast at lager temperature with an ale timeline which IMO will never work unless making a steam or something similar. Lagers take 3 times the duration of an ale just to ferment in my experience, however I tend to ferment lagers around 45F.
I guess that depends on what he defines as an ale timeline, since some people on here (not me) leave their beers in primary for a minimum of 4 weeks. Then he can lager in his keg, or bottle and then "lager" in bottles. Plus, at 50-55 his beer won't take much longer than an ale (or at least not 3 times as long...maybe 2x) to ferment. Btw, why are you fermenting at 45? I've never seen anyone recommend anything other than pitching at that temperature and letting the temp rise to 48-52, or perhaps 46 for a bock.
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Old 09-26-2012, 12:50 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by COLObrewer View Post
Not sure what the OP is wanting but it appears he wants to use a lager yeast at lager temperature with an ale timeline which IMO will never work unless making a steam or something similar. Lagers take 3 times the duration of an ale just to ferment in my experience, however I tend to ferment lagers around 45F.
I started thinking about this issue after drinking a beer from a local Microbrewery called Jack's Abby Brewery. Jack's Abby ferments all of their beers as traditional lagers, using lager yeast. Several of their beers appear based on traditional ale recipes, including the lager equivalent of a porter, an IPA and a copper ale, all of which are made as "true" lagers, but taste very similarly to me to their ale equivalent. (Perhaps I just have an unsophisticated palate.) However, it got me to thinking about how every winter I have to worry about trying to keep the fermenting wort in my basement warm enough to keep the (ale) yeast active. I wondered whether, rather than fight the low temps, I could take advantage of them by using a lager yeast in my ale recipes, fermented on an ale timeline (4 weeks is fine), and end up with a beer that tastes like a really clean ale. Am I off base?
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Old 09-26-2012, 01:05 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Skipper74 View Post
I started thinking about this issue after drinking a beer from a local Microbrewery called Jack's Abby Brewery. Jack's Abby ferments all of their beers as traditional lagers, using lager yeast. Several of their beers appear based on traditional ale recipes, including the lager equivalent of a porter, an IPA and a copper ale, all of which are made as "true" lagers, but taste very similarly to me to their ale equivalent. (Perhaps I just have an unsophisticated palate.) However, it got me to thinking about how every winter I have to worry about trying to keep the fermenting wort in my basement warm enough to keep the (ale) yeast active. I wondered whether, rather than fight the low temps, I could take advantage of them by using a lager yeast in my ale recipes, fermented on an ale timeline (4 weeks is fine), and end up with a beer that tastes like a really clean ale. Am I off base?
If your basement is 55, active fermentation with s-23 could get you up closer to the high 50s. It MAY be possible to do it in 4 weeks. S-23 can be clean at higher temps like that.
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