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Old 05-23-2013, 01:12 AM   #11
rrayriver
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If you follow through on this, make sure you're either using one of those Lindemann's faux lambics that's been pasteurized, or you use bottles that can handle heavy pressure. If you add a live lambic beer to this, and expect to age it (as you should for a quad), you're going to have a bunch of bottle bombs on your hands. You probably already know this, but one can't be too careful.
GuldTuborg,
I appreciate the thought on the exploding bottles. This has been the topic of discussion with several fellow brewer friends and havent come up with a certain result. The Lindemans I plan to add is the Kriek Lambic. Are you thinking I might have exploding bottles due to sugar or existing carbonation in the Kriek Lambic? If its because of the carbonation, I could let off a good part before adding, eg, pouring several times vigorously. The discussion has been would they explode due to the sugar in the lambic. If so, should I cut back on bottling sugar? I have also thought of adding a cherry slurry from boiling some dried cherries-no sugar added. Or I could add the cherry slurry to the secondary so that some of that sugar ferments out leaving the cherry notes. So the question is how is all this going to come to play in the bottle? I need a chemist consult. Or maybe I should keg this one, but its a dang big beer to have on draft. My current plan is to bottle 25% with no added bottling sugar, then add 2-3oz and bottle 25% more, then add another 1-2oz and bottle the rest and take notes on each. Open to any thoughts.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:39 AM   #12
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Update on the stuck quad: I conducted the above (add yeast hulls, make a starter with high gravity yeast with nutrient and pitch) and it was very active for over three days and got down to 1.019. So it looks like the plan worked. Today I gave it a swirl. Being that my starting gravity was lower than what I wanted (1.083 rather than the planned 1.095) due to stuck sparge, I would like to get it down as far as I can-1.016 or lower. Sure glad I didnt "through it out".

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Old 05-23-2013, 03:49 AM   #13
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I'm glad you didn't throw it out, too. Only do that as a last resort. And I really mean last, as in it doesn't even make (in the case of this type of beer) a good chili or chocolate cake.

As for the bottle bomb issue, it's the bugs you have to worry about. Add the Lindemann's, or drink it within a few months, and you'll be fine. Were you to add, for example, Drie Fonteinen Kriek, and set some aside for aging, you will have trouble.

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Old 05-23-2013, 01:42 PM   #14
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Very glad to hear it picked up again. Rousing the yeast (as you say you're doing) and the tail end of fermentation may still push it below 1.016, even if most visible fermentation has completed.

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Old 05-23-2013, 11:06 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrayriver View Post
Brewing is like religion, so many opinions and most assume they are right. .
Brewing is a science.
Despite the fact that Humanity has been brewing for the past 8 millennia, (or even longer) our grasp of its science is minimal at best.
That's why you'll see so many opinions and "urban myths" being propagated.

The part that is "Brewing Art" is the science we haven't figured out yet.
Do your part, experiment, and report back so we can increase our collective knowledge.

As far as fiddling with a Quad after only five days... well that's probably unwise. If you've done your job correctly re: you little yeasty army, they'll do all the battle for you.
We feed the yeast, it makes the beer.
Cheers.
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Old 05-24-2013, 04:01 AM   #16
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The part that is "Brewing Art" is the science we haven't figured out yet.
If you look at just brewing, apart from the drinking and experiencing of the resultant beer, I might be willing to entertain this like of thinking (though I still find it difficult to think of the creativity that goes into recipe and process creation and combination as anything but art, at least in part). But the whole point of brewing is to experience the finished beer, and there is no science that can fully account for the way in which a beer seems to us when we see, smell, and taste it. So, there will always be some art, some dabbling into the unknown and unknowable (scientifically speaking) when it comes to the brewing process.
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Old 05-24-2013, 04:33 AM   #17
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Don't forget to warm up the beer late in fermentation, 3787 needs late warmth to finish up. 75-80° for a few days helps prevent bottle bombs. The last few gravity points, primary or secondary, are usually slow to come down too.

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Old 05-28-2013, 03:37 PM   #18
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Final Update on stuck quad: I got it down to 1.013-PERFECT! It comes in at 9.2 ABV-right where I wanted it. Sounds like the answer to my question, at least in this case, was adding yeast hulls, pitch a new starter with yeast nutrient and warm it up. After it slows, rouse the yeast with a swift swirl and you are on your way. Thanks for all the ideas. It was a great learning experience. As for the Kriek addition at bottling, I am going to add a slurry of boiled dried cherries to the secondary for a couple of weeks and at bottling I will only add about 5% Kriek to the final 5-6 bottles to experiment. If they explode, at least I will have a good batch of cherry infused quad to enjoy and let sit for awhile.

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Old 05-29-2013, 01:07 PM   #19
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rrayriver,
Don't boil your cherries. If you boil fruit you're going to create pectin which will cloud your beer but more importantly you're going to negatively effect the flavor of your cherries. It's a much better bet to put them in water and hold the temp between 150 - 180 for 10-20 min. This will sterilize them. You can do a lower temp for a longer time or a higher temp for a shorter time but definitely don't boil or you're not going to get a good cherry flavor.

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Old 05-31-2013, 12:10 AM   #20
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Cernst,
Thanks for that invaluable tip! Much appreciated! Since you seem to know about how to handle fruit, do you have a sense of the cherries effect on bottling? Should I reduce the amount of bottling sugar?

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