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Old 02-08-2013, 03:32 PM   #11
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Actually, most lagers don't call for "hard" water so maybe some of your additions aren't exactly right? Just a thought! We can help with a water profile if you want, as when I make lagers my additions to RO water really are minimal. Sulfate in the brewing water can make noble hops sort of harsh and "not quite right" tasting.
I'm trying to perfect a Munich Helles. I've read that the water in Munich is hard.


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Old 02-08-2013, 06:40 PM   #12
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Yooper, I'm going to be brewing an Oktoberfest (extract) tomorrow using RO water, and would love to hear your suggestions for a water profile.

FWIW, I did a three step starter of 2124 to get up over 424B cells called for, and will be fermenting in a water bath in my 57 degree basement.

Thanks in advance.
Straight RO water is fine, especially for an extract Oktoberfest. If you really wanted to do something, you could add a teaspoon of calcium chloride, but it's not necessary.


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Old 02-08-2013, 06:42 PM   #13
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I'm trying to perfect a Munich Helles. I've read that the water in Munich is hard.
Actually, the preferred water for a helles is soft! Here's some info from Kai Troester's website: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php/Various_water_recipes#very_soft_water
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:58 PM   #14
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Straight RO it is! Thank you.

I'll pick up calcium chloride the next time I'm at the LHBS.

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Old 02-10-2013, 01:46 PM   #15
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Actually, the preferred water for a helles is soft! Here's some info from Kai Troester's website: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php/Various_water_recipes#very_soft_water
I use RO water in my brews. I'm gonna try Kai's recipe and see how different it comes out than mine. I really want to nail down this style and consistently brew it.
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Old 02-10-2013, 02:55 PM   #16
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I dislike a long primary, even for ales, as I can pick up a flavor imparted by the yeast.
Anyway you can be more specific about "a flavor"?
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Old 02-10-2013, 03:05 PM   #17
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Anyway you can be more specific about "a flavor"?
It's a definite yeast character. I can taste it in ales that have spent a long time in the primary, too. I know some people actually prefer that, and preach a "month in primary" but I don't like it. It takes away from the "clean" finish in my opinion.
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Old 02-10-2013, 03:10 PM   #18
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It's a definite yeast character. I can taste it in ales that have spent a long time in the primary, too. I know some people actually prefer that, and preach a "month in primary" but I don't like it. It takes away from the "clean" finish in my opinion.
Interesting as people seem to think the yeast spend a month 'cleaning up after themselves' implying a cleaner beer.
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Old 02-10-2013, 03:17 PM   #19
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Interesting as people seem to think the yeast spend a month 'cleaning up after themselves' implying a cleaner beer.
Yes, but I think that's a very vocal minority. I don't think you'll hear that from most of the more experienced brewers, and I hear it on this forum repeated incessently but only by a minority.

The "clean up" phase of the yeast's life cycle is about 24 hours or so, at the tail end of primary fermentation. That's when the preferred fermentable sugars are gone, and then the yeast will go after the less preferential sugars (like maltiose) and then finally start to digest their own waste products when fermentables are gone. This certainly doesn't take all that long- maybe a day or two after FG is reached is a safe bet to ensure it's finished and clearing starts.

Interestingly, Basic Brewing Radio did an experiment a couple of years ago with the same recipe and doing a traditional "primary/secondary", primary only short term, and primary only long term.

All people noted differences in the final beer. The interesting part of that was some preferred the shorter time in the fermenter, while nearly as many preferred the longer time in the fermenter. So it really is personal preference, as some definitely do find the long primary preferable!
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Old 02-10-2013, 06:23 PM   #20
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Can you explain at what point/steps you guys take to do your diacetyl rest? I am at at 1.019 on my American pilsner, estimated FG being 1.016. I bumped my fermentation chamber/kegerator to 55 degrees, allowing it to slowly warm up. At what temp do you warm it up to and over how long? Then rack to secondary? Fermented for 7 days so far, overpitched by about 20 billion cells per yeastcalc.com, aerated with pure O2 for 60 secs, and pitched at 52 degrees, and has held between 50 and 52 degrees during fermentation also.

Any help is greatly appreciated!
Thanks!
Ryan



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