Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Fermentation & Yeast > O2 Results from my new O2 meter!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-26-2013, 12:46 PM   #41
dstar26t
If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ridley Park, PA
Posts: 1,148
Liked 18 Times on 17 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rundownhouse View Post
I'm... skeptical... of something reading 300ppm. Maybe dstar meant ppb?
That's calculated ppm at 100% efficiency, only 5.8% of it was dissolved so there was 17.5 ppm in solution measured.
__________________

Next: ?
Fermenting: Munich Helles v4, Dusseldorf Altbier v5, Oktoberfest v5, Dopplebock v2, Cider, Barrel Fermented Dreg Lambic, Brett Trois Helles, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead
Drinking: Mitis Saxon (brewed @ Earth - Bread + Brewery), Rye Berliner Weisse, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Conan DIPA, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
Barrel aged: RIS, Rye Barleywine, Tripel

dstar26t is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-26-2013, 12:53 PM   #42
passedpawn
Waste Allocation Load Lifter - Earth Class
HBT_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
passedpawn's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: ☼ Clearwater, FL ☼
Posts: 18,583
Liked 3184 Times on 1990 Posts
Likes Given: 2712

Default

Great thread guys. Love it.

__________________
What Would Vermeer Paint?
passedpawn is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-26-2013, 05:40 PM   #43
aarong
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 188
Liked 17 Times on 14 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demus

I'd like to see these too. I did read in "Yeast" that air only has 8 ppm or so, making it impossible to get more than 8 with any non-O2 method. Being involved in both aviation and scuba diving, I understand a bit about how gasses diffuse into liquids. Basically the bigger the differential (called partial pressure) the faster the rate of diffusion. So if you target is 8-12 ppm, you can only get to the minimum of your target and it will take a LONG time to get there because of the low partial pressure. This fits with test I read done by White Labs that found 5 minutes of "vigorous" shaking only resulted in 2.7 ppm dissolved oxygen. I believe this is one of the biggest causes of problem fermentations among newer brewers.
I have been searching for where it says that you only get 2.7 ppm from vigorous shaking. I did try wyeast website. I am very curious about this. Do you still have a link for this info? Thanks!

Also I heard from white labs that you can get 8 ppm from vigorous shaking (but I doubt it) unless you can pick up the whole bucket and shake the crap out of it.

Thanks
__________________

Fermenting: Tripel
Keg: empty
Bottle: empty
Vissani fermentor build

aarong is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-26-2013, 10:06 PM   #44
lockwom
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Falls Church, VA
Posts: 107
Liked 13 Times on 8 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seven View Post
Another test that you might consider would be to skip using the wand and instead flood the head space of the fermentor with O2 for a few seconds then shake the fermentor for 30-seconds. Do this flood and shake process a total of two times then measure the results. I read elsewhere recently that this is another good way to oxygenate wort with pure O2 without the wand. I'm curious what level of dissolved O2 this method would achieve.

Thanks for posting your results!
I don't have a DO meter, but I've saved substantial O2 using this method. I purge the headspace a few seconds until I can smell wort aroma escaping, cap tightly with foil and vigorously tilt the carboy back and forth on the floor to absorb. Not too much effort, and I repeat two to three times, depending on OG.

Not certain if I hit the ideal O2 range, but equivalent recipes perform as well as the O2 stone with less oxygen, and less sanitation risk.

As dstar26's data indicates, a lot of O2 escapes with the stone. I feel the headspace purge/shake can get you in range with less oxygen.
__________________
lockwom is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-26-2013, 10:27 PM   #45
BrewingPrepper
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lexington, North Carolina
Posts: 62
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

I would be interested in seeing what the spray aerator can do. My LHBS says that is what he uses and sells with his kits. I have used it for both my brews. However I really want to get more oxygen in I think it has to do with my weak fermentation.

__________________

Drinking-IPA
Fermenter-Oatmeal Stout

If anyone has concerns about the direction the world is going please PM me for more details...

BrewingPrepper is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2013, 01:02 PM   #46
Huff360
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Madison, Alabama
Posts: 419
Liked 50 Times on 40 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrewingPrepper View Post
I would be interested in seeing what the spray aerator can do. My LHBS says that is what he uses and sells with his kits. I have used it for both my brews. However I really want to get more oxygen in I think it has to do with my weak fermentation.
You are bound to the same upper limit as any other method of aerating. There is only so much oxygen in air. The only way you can get over 8ppm is with oxygenation of some manner.

People have brewed great beer for many many years without using pressurized Oxygen. Spalsh/shake vigorously, follow proper pitching guidelines, and use a yeast nutrient and you should have good fermentation.

Pressurized Oxygen, like water chemistry, should be something you worry with after your beer has gotten as good as it possibly can. Superior sanitation, ferm temp, full boil, and pitch rate should all be figured out first. In my opinion, in that order. If you have only made 2 batches, there are likely a lot better places for you to spend your money and make glarger improvements on your beer.
__________________
Huff360 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2013, 04:44 PM   #47
zymurgistic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 16
Default

gavagai,
you're basically asking the central question, how to judge volumetric flowrates. unfortunately, there are too many moving parts to be able to even qualitatively say what 1 lpm vs 3 lpm looks like, in terms of bubbles formed, foam formed on top, etc. the only way to be sure is to pick up a flowmeter. i got a cheap plastic one from welder supply for about $15 that i plan to install inline for next test. then there's the whole question about how much gas actually dissolved instead of bubbled to surface and escaped. if you're ready to invest in O2 tank, i'd say figure out who can loan you a DO meter for a wkend and then, using buckets of water and plain sugar to certain gravs, fix on a good combo of flowrate/psi/time that gives you over ten ppm and then you can just use that forevermore with confidence.

__________________
zymurgistic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2013, 05:00 PM   #48
zymurgistic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 16
Default

so if anybody out there has a DO meter, a flowmeter*, and lots of time and a fresh 20cf tank fill of O2 to burn, here are the tests we'd all like to see.

--2 micron vs. 0.5 micron diffusion stone
--DO rates at different OG's
--time versus flowrate combinations, which is most efficient? assuming that slower rate for longer time results in less loss of O2 bubbling off at surface, what is the diminishing returns point? is it linear, or is there a sharp ramp off somewhere?

if you picked up half a dozen cheapo 5-gal buckets from Lowes/HD, and a giant bag of table sugar, you could simulate worts for testing. if you wanted to test three different gravities (1.050, 1.065, and 10.80), and three different flowrate/time combos, AND the two different airstones, this would take

2 airstone x 3 gravs x 3 flowrate/time = 18 tests.

* using a medical oxygen regulator with the lpm setting won't work as a flowmeter here, unfortunately. that's only accurate for unrestricted flow, and we have restricted flow due to the airstone, and to a lesser extent, the atmospheric pressure of 15 in or so of liquid above the outflow. so it has to either be a thorpe tube style volumetric flowmeter inline from the tank, or just regulator psi. reg psi will be a decent number since, if another guy is using the same micron airstone, his rig should act more or less the same as yours, and same psi/time should give same ppm DO. the advantage of the thorpe tube is that it will also tell you how much of your tank you're using per bucket, which is also a concern.

any takers??

__________________
zymurgistic is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2013, 05:07 PM   #49
day_trippr
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Stow, MA
Posts: 9,919
Liked 1144 Times on 928 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zymurgistic View Post
[...]
* using a medical oxygen regulator with the lpm setting won't work as a flowmeter here, unfortunately. that's only accurate for unrestricted flow[...]
I disagree with your presumption wrt restriction in the system giving inaccurate flow meter readings. An analogy would be a household water meter not working unless all of the taps were wide open...

Cheers!
__________________
day_trippr is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2013, 05:57 PM   #50
TTB
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 44
Liked 6 Times on 3 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aarong View Post
I have been searching for where it says that you only get 2.7 ppm from vigorous shaking. I did try wyeast website. I am very curious about this. Do you still have a link for this info? Thanks!

Also I heard from white labs that you can get 8 ppm from vigorous shaking (but I doubt it) unless you can pick up the whole bucket and shake the crap out of it.

Thanks
The book "Yeast" by Jamil and Chris White. Shows a table of oxygen levels by various methods. IIRC, shaking ranged from 2.5-4.5.

I think it may have said a ridiculous amount shaking could get you to 8...but I don't think most people (even if you think you are shaking a lot) can get that from shaking.
__________________
TTB is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Anyone tried this low cost oxygen flow meter? McCue Fermentation & Yeast 14 09-17-2013 09:18 PM
2 rehydrations 2 different results smellgoats Fermentation & Yeast 6 05-25-2012 11:11 PM
Results of yeast washing -- is there enough? ed_brews_now Fermentation & Yeast 4 07-22-2011 11:44 PM
Good results with S-04 in a barleywine Nateo Fermentation & Yeast 5 02-20-2011 07:20 PM
New stir plate - results are in old_tx_kbb Fermentation & Yeast 11 10-16-2010 02:18 PM