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Old 01-21-2010, 07:14 PM   #1
Dave258
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Default Mr. Malty and yeast starters

I am thinking of getting the Pliny Clone from AHS and doing some research on what to pitch in a big beer.

AHS suggest to double pitch, but Mr. Malty says I can get away with a 3 liter starter.
Does a three liter starter sound like it would work? I think the OG is 1.071 and the yeast theay are recomending is Wyeast 1056 American Ale. I wonder if they are out of WLP001. I have never used Wyeast yet.

If the three liter starter is good, can I build on a 2 liter? I only have a 2 liter flask.
Make a two liter starter, leave on stirplate for 2 days, let settle, decant, add new starter wort let stir another 2 days?
How does that sound?
As always, thanks for the help on this great site!!!!

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Old 01-21-2010, 07:19 PM   #2
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if you have a stir plate it says you only need a 1.3 liter starter

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Old 01-21-2010, 07:26 PM   #3
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if you have a stir plate it says you only need a 1.3 liter starter
That is if you start with 2 vials of yeast I think. Am I reading it wrong?

I only want to use one vial of yeast (save 7.00) and make a bigger starter.
I slid the slider on the bottom until it said 1 vial, and that is where it says a 3.14 Liter starter. I also changed the Production date, of the yeast figuring I will not get yeast produced in January.
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Old 01-21-2010, 07:43 PM   #4
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I think you are reading it wrong. Did you change the dropdown to stirplate?

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Old 01-21-2010, 07:53 PM   #5
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I think you are reading it wrong. Did you change the dropdown to stirplate?
yes. If you leave the production date of the yeast at today's date, it says 1.32 liter starter. But isn't that if the yeast is packaged today?

I just looked at a vial of WLP300 I have in the fridge for a Dunkelweizen I am brewing soon. The best before date is April 15, 2010. It then says that the package date is 4 months before the best before date. Meaning that that yeast was put in the vial on or around December 15.

Do you guys not change the production date when calculating the size of your starter?
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Old 01-21-2010, 08:33 PM   #6
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yes. If you leave the production date of the yeast at today's date, it says 1.32 liter starter. But isn't that if the yeast is packaged today?

I just looked at a vial of WLP300 I have in the fridge for a Dunkelweizen I am brewing soon. The best before date is April 15, 2010. It then says that the package date is 4 months before the best before date. Meaning that that yeast was put in the vial on or around December 15.

Do you guys not change the production date when calculating the size of your starter?
yeah, but it wont double the size of starter needed
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:46 PM   #7
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yeah, but it wont double the size of starter needed
Uh, yes it will.

I set it back 2 months, and it went from 1.32 to 2.7 ....me calls that doubling.

OP, the prevailing wisdom here is that stepping up doesn't do anything. Yeast hit a "terminal concentration", in any wort, and stop reproducing. So, if you make a 2L starter, decant, then add 2L more wort, you will have the exact same amount of yeast in the end as you had before you decanted...

I don't really believe this prevailing wisdom, but that's just me. To do it "right", you need the size starter listed. You COULD make a 2L starter, then dump it into a 1 gallon jug and shake it around lots and hope you get close...or just stick with 2L and hope.
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Old 01-21-2010, 11:16 PM   #8
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Thanks shorty. That is what I meant. I put it back 4 months, and that is when it said a 3 liter starter.
I thought if I would split it up and did 2 equal shots of 1500 ml of starter wort I could end up with a 3 liter starter.
Guess I'll need to buy a bigger flask already. Or be saved if the yeast is fresher.

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Old 01-22-2010, 03:58 PM   #9
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OP, the prevailing wisdom here is that stepping up doesn't do anything. Yeast hit a "terminal concentration", in any wort, and stop reproducing. So, if you make a 2L starter, decant, then add 2L more wort, you will have the exact same amount of yeast in the end as you had before you decanted...


Is that what stepping up is considered around here? I would say stepping up is a gradual increase of starter size in order to increase yeast populations. So, say start with a 2L starter and add that yeast to 5L or something for a lager, or start with a Brett vial and throw that into 200-300ml, and then throw that into 2-3L.

Where is the stepping up if you keep the size of the starter the same?
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Old 01-22-2010, 04:03 PM   #10
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Is that what stepping up is considered around here? I would say stepping up is a gradual increase of starter size in order to increase yeast populations. So, say start with a 2L starter and add that yeast to 5L or something for a lager, or start with a Brett vial and throw that into 200-300ml, and then throw that into 2-3L.

Where is the stepping up if you keep the size of the starter the same?
Sorry, used the wrong lingo. Stepping up means what you said, right. Start small, (few hundred mLs,), ferment that out, decant, pitch into 2L, repeat, etc.

The idea with stepping up is to not stress the yeast. You can't easily dump a culture from a slant into 2L of wort and have it grow up big and strong without lots of stress on the yeast....but again, prevailing wisdom is that, no matter how you get to 2L (or whatever), you'll always have the same concentration of yeast. Again, I don't quite believe this, but take it for what you will. Most of the "higher ups" around here in terms of experience preach the "terminal concentration" theory, (held by Sacc, Jamil, and others), so who am I to say no?
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