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Old 08-28-2010, 05:19 AM   #1
Jmat
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Default Add yeast energizer to a saison to finish it?

Haven't posted here in a while, though I often lurk. I've got a saison in primary for about three weeks now. Recipe as follows:
3 gallon batch
Wyeast 3724 Belgian Saison
5 lbs. Bavarian Pilsener, 2 row, (Partial Mash)
1 lb. Pilsen Light DME, Breiss (late addition)
1lb. Bavarian Wheat DME, Breiss (late addition)
1.25ish oz. Saaz, Czech, 4% AA – Bittering (60 min)
.75ish oz. Saaz, Czech, 4% AA – Aroma (15-10 min)
8 oz. Corn Sugar
1 tsp. Irish Moss
I mashed at around 148-150F. I forgot to take a gravity reading but some software I tried suggested it ought be around 1.079. It predicted an FG of 1.017. Trying to apply what I've read I pitched the 3724 at around 75F and let it ramp up to 85-90F. It went all out for about three days and then stalled, probably due to the fact that the ambient temp dropped significantly. I warmed it back up and pitched some champagne yeast because, you know, I had some. It seemed to start back up again as of 8/22, it's been at about 1.012 and is clearing despite my attempts to rouse the yeast. It tastes pretty good.

My question is that 1.012 is certainly not "bone dry" as per the style and the reports I've heard about 3724 say you ought to be able to get down farther.

My questions is would there be anything wrong with adding some yeast energizer to it at this point or could that result in off flavors? I know I should just let it sit for another 4 weeks or so, but I'm just getting over some infection issues in my batches (this one seems ok) and I'm wary of letting this sit around at 75ish degrees. I could lower the temp to something more sane like 65F, but I'm thinking neither the champagne yeast nor the 3724 is going to accomplish much at that temperature. Thoughts?

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Old 08-29-2010, 05:15 PM   #2
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In Designing Great Beers (I think) I remember reading about people using champagne yeast to try to boost attenuation, but in the sample of NHC Second-Round beers, the beers with champagne yeast were not any better attenuated than those without.

I don't really care for bone-dry saisons, so I would be happy with 1.012. You might knock a couple points off that if you give it more time, but maybe not.

Yeast energizer probably won't do much. A 12 point FG doesn't sound like a "stuck fermentation" to me.

Next time mash at <146 and double the corn sugar, and you could probably get down to about 8 points.

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Old 08-29-2010, 05:37 PM   #3
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IMO….

I’ve noticed a pickup with fermentation after racking to a secondary I attribute this to aeration of the wart, this yeast as you know is notorious for a stalled/ sluggish fermentation towards the end IMO this style needs about a month and bottle conditioning.... I wouldn’t add any yeast energizer now.

Ditch the corn sugar and invert table sugar (boil with water and lemon juice to invert) some say there’s no difference but I swear corn sugar imparts an off flavor and its cheaper …just my opinion

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Old 08-29-2010, 07:37 PM   #4
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1.079->1.012 is 85% attenuation. It's probably done. If want drier, replace some more of the extract with sugar next time, or go all-grain (because you can't control the fermentability of extract)

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Old 08-30-2010, 03:33 AM   #5
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Thanks all. Upon further reflection and after reading the responses, I decided I'm going to call this done. I'm cold crashing and I'll bottle in a couple days. I figure even if it still goes down a bit, I should be safe from bottle bombs as long as I only carb to a sane level.

@rugman: It never occurred to me to use the invert sugar. I figure I'm probably ok with such a small amount of dextrose. I'm curious what you use for priming?

I've actually been meaning to start messing around with invert sugar and caramelized syrups and whatnot using DAP after reading a thread about that on here.

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Old 08-30-2010, 04:02 AM   #6
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farmhouse ales by phil markowski indicates some saison brewers use inverted sugar.


I use white satin sugar i just found out today in fact that it's actually beet sugar


here's a thread about candi & inverted sugar
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/homemade-dark-belgian-candi-sugar-syrup-193103/

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Old 08-30-2010, 05:32 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmat View Post
TI'm going to call this done.


Wise choice, almost always best to stop adding stuff trying to squeeze the last few points out of a beer, that are theoretical anyway.
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Old 08-30-2010, 06:09 AM   #8
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what yeast most saisons ferment dry but work slow... let it ride and maybe bring it up to a warmer temp. saisons like warm.

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Old 08-30-2010, 12:13 PM   #9
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Mine finished at 1.012. It tastes fantastic and not real dry. Has a good spice and so forth. Mine went to 83% attenuation but I think a small part of it was I used some jaggery which has all the unrefined stuff that might not fully ferment. I had mine warm at like 85-87 degrees for two weeks trying to get it to finish.

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