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Old 06-17-2010, 10:11 PM   #1
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Default Ya have to give credit where credit is due...

Ya have to give credit where credit is due...I just got done watching Age of Empires in regards to brewng and while I won't give the BMC beers a second glance I can appreciate the history of those breweries in regards to the US brewing story and the tumultuous times that they had to overcome (ie WW I and II along with Prohibition) It would he nice to try a vntage BMC pilsner from that tme...Take it for what its worth but they are somewhat instrumental to our hobby and the lifestyle...

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Old 06-17-2010, 10:48 PM   #2
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Kind of. I mean, yea, their story of adversity is great and at the time when there were few options it would be easy to raise a glass and toast to that, but let's be honest - they are not concerned with making "good (quality)" beer now as much as they are about making a buck. It really comes down to what this hobby/industry is about, and to me it's comradery (sp?). Beer brings so many people from all different walks of life together. It allows you the opportunity to sit, relax, create, converse, etc etc. I think the "smaller" breweries today are much more commendable than BMC has ever been regardless of what they have or have not had to over come. These guys are not necessarily out to make a dollar but to help thy neighbor (if you will). If you have a favorite brew and contact your favorite brewery for said recipe you more than likely will be welcomed with open arms and flattery and you will end up with some variation of the recipe to brew on your own. The smaller breweries often get together to do a collaboration and create some signature limited beer. These are things you would never get from BMC bc the bottom line to them is money (thus rice as a major ingredient in their beer which I honestly think we can all agree is inferior to the quality ingredients used by microbrewers). Don't get me wrong, everyone needs to make a buck, and BMC is easy to hate based on market share alone, but at the end of they day it seems to me that they (current day) stand for everything that the brewing industry (on a minority level) doesn't.

I think proof that these guys are too big for their own good is in the fact that they try to create these "craft" beers and hide behind the labels - I'm looking at you Shock Top, Blue Moon, etc. Why suddenly is there a need to appeal to the "craft beer market?" Oh, bc it's another opportunity to make another dollar? It's just out of control IMO. They have SO much money, and SO many resources to push this industry far beyond what we know, yet they make rice beer that we know is cold when the Mtns turn blue (bc cold beer is a sure sign of good beer), or that is triple hopped (which is clearly unheard of), or that is "frost brewed" (which is what exactly?). It is all about using the cheapest ingredients to reduce overhead to make the most money possible and cover it up with marketing that we have become brain washed into thinking is desirable.

I know I am preaching to the choir, and I dont mean to blow up your post and be a jerk off bc I honestly am not approaching it that way, nor am I genuinely fired up - but I am sure you see my point.

It would be a good debate as to whether beer would be where it is today if we didnt have the history of BMC that we do today, and I too would love to try an original pilsner from them but let's not pretend they are pushing this industry in the right direction.

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Old 06-17-2010, 10:56 PM   #3
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True, but it's not like craft breweries aren't out to make a buck either. I'm pretty sure everyone from Jim Koch to Sam Calagione very much enjoy the fat paycheck they're making, and I don't think any less of them for that. I think the only people really free from this criticism are the Trappist monks whose beer proceeds go back into the monasteries and the surrounding communities. Everyone else essentially combined a passion for beer with a way to make money off it, and there's nothing wrong with that.

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Old 06-17-2010, 11:20 PM   #4
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As I said, everyone needs to make a buck. If you can do it by doing something you are passionate about kudos to you, I think you have acheived the American Dream and there is nothing wrong with that, but dont tell me Jim Koch and Sam Calagione are comparable to the wigs a BMC. One hand is connected to the people, the other couldnt be further removed.

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Old 06-18-2010, 12:51 AM   #5
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Mistymountains, you have the right idea but I think your are using the wrong "evidence", so to speak, to back it up.

First off, this hobby/industry are two totally different things. A hobby is just that, a hobby. Anyone who is selling beer is doing it for the main reason of making money. Craft brewers may have a different idea and business model, but the purpose is the same: to make money.

The BMC companies are not "evil" to me because of how they make their beer. The vast majority of the beer drinking public buys it, and buys a LOT of it. You can't deny that, and no matter what we think, there is nothing wrong with that. If the product is not dangerous to people (and of course I know alcohol is in many aspects, but I mean dangerous as in cyanide as an ingredient, cancerous sweeteners, etc), then if they use pure table sugar to ferment into "beer" and people still want to buy it, well, how can you fault them? They aren't a government agency, so they have every right in a FREE MARKET to do what they are doing.

That said, their marketing and the way they leverage the market can be discussed in a negative light for sure. That's where the problem lies.

But if you think Joe Smith who opened a single-owner brew pub a mile from your house has a different goal in mind than BMC, you are sorely mistaken.

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Old 06-18-2010, 07:13 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MistyMountainHops View Post
As I said, everyone needs to make a buck. If you can do it by doing something you are passionate about kudos to you, I think you have acheived the American Dream and there is nothing wrong with that, but dont tell me Jim Koch and Sam Calagione are comparable to the wigs a BMC. One hand is connected to the people, the other couldnt be further removed.
They're a lot closer than you think--many of the Anheuser Busch brewers are active in the craft and homebrew world, and very connected to the people.

Heck, Mitch Steele moved over from being the assistant brewmaster at A-B to being the head brewer for Stone.
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Old 06-18-2010, 11:49 AM   #7
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I'm pretty sure the brewers at AB and other macros are not exactly excited about the beer they make day in and day out. I suspect they really want to try different recipes and showcase their talents in other styles.

However, you can't change Budweiser on a whim. They are beholden to the recipes and the customer expectations that have been built up for many years. And being a brewer on that scale has got to be a very different approach than a micro brewer, or homebrewer. I'm sure they must feel fairly disconnected from the beer itself.

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Old 06-18-2010, 12:44 PM   #8
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I feel like we are saying the same thing to an extent, and forgive me for maybe not presenting this the way I should have.

I agree that it takes money to keep a business afloat, etc - but I still dont think many micros are out there for market domination (to the extent of AB). Obviously those would be big shoes to fill, and maybe I am naive, but I have to think that money is not the main motivating factor for some of these guys in the industry. As this all started - there has to be some sort of passion before the dollar.

I also agree that those guys at BMC probably arent too stoked on their limitations on what they have to brew day in and day out, thus people leaving the big boys to go start and or join smaller operations with more freedom. But to that point, was it about the money or was it about the ability to have creative freedom?

I dont hate BMC at all. I just hate these perceptions their marketing departments throw out there that are completely absurd. They have the resources to educate the majority of the market (that truly thinks their beer is the best - which is okay) on what brewing is, how the process really works, and on and on - yet they cloud the consumer's head with these "gimmicky" ad campaigns. I mean, I tip my hat to them bc I am sure the vortex bottle is going to increase sales, but really?!

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Old 06-18-2010, 03:51 PM   #9
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Actually, I think that most regular people would see the vortex bottle as the BS marketing ploy that it is. There's a lot of dumb people in the world, but I don't think this is over their heads.

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Old 06-18-2010, 04:10 PM   #10
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I understand mistymountains point completely, and i believe there are 2 different types of breweries. in it for the money, and in it for the taste. U might think that any brewery no matter the size is in the business to make a profit. but thats just not true. That's what advertising leads you to believe and BMC uses it to their full advantage. They lead us to believe that they use the highest quality ingredients so we can have quality/affordable beer to drink. BS. They use the cheapest possible ingredients and advertise that they use the best. Theres a reason why its so cheap and its not just due to the mass production. If a microbrewery wanted to switch to using less quality ingredients to save a buck then the quality of the beer will most likely suffer as well. So that company will increase their advertising to make sure they dont lose the respect that they already have. So now we have BMC, and things like mcdonalds and walmart. Gotta love the American dream

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