Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Beer Discussion > Why are There No New BJCP Style Guidelines?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 07-13-2010, 04:48 PM   #21
remilard
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 3,655
Liked 38 Times on 37 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whatsleftofyou View Post
That'd be a mistake. As much as I enjoy both rye and black IPAs, I'd hammer them (especially the black) if they put in front of me on a judging table to be judged as 14B. Unfortunately I've had some really good beers while judging that I had to give bad scores to because they were entered into the wrong category.
The BYO type black IPA (one that tastes like a regular IPA with your eyes closed) should score well as appearance is 3 points and covers things other than color.
__________________
remilard is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-13-2010, 09:30 PM   #22
whatsleftofyou
Third Eye Pried Wide
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
whatsleftofyou's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: U.P. of MI
Posts: 591
Liked 9 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by remilard View Post
The BYO type black IPA (one that tastes like a regular IPA with your eyes closed) should score well as appearance is 3 points and covers things other than color.
Maybe it would get a decent overall score, but every point counts, especially in one of the most-entered categories. I personally take 2 off for appearance if something is WAY off like that.
__________________
My Bar Build
Primary: Rhubarb Berliner Weisse
Secondary: American Barleywine
On Tap: Orange Chocolate Stout, Belgian Wit, Chocolate Rye Ale, Belgian Singel, American Pale Ale
Bottled: PB&J Sweet Stout, Belgian Saison, Brown Porter

whatsleftofyou is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-13-2010, 09:45 PM   #23
Grizzlybrew
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Grizzlybrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Douglasville, GA
Posts: 1,197
Liked 13 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by whatsleftofyou View Post
I'd say that you're right, but here is the reasoning:

1) People brew to meet BJCP for 2 reasons:
A- Because it's easier to learn to brew to style first before shooting from the hip, and
B- To win competitions. You won't win if you're not brewing to the guidelines against which your beer will be judged.
I didn't mean it in a bad way. I guess I meant that with the BJCP, sometimes, it seems the styles come first and are then used for homebrewers to target when they brew, whereas the BA attempts to define what exists in the market place after the styles have been brewed. I understand, that BJCP also recognizes styles and are not creating styles out of thin air, but maybe I'm just talking about the way that people use the two systems or at least the way I perceive people using them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denny View Post
I guess I don't see why a commercial beer should fall within the BJCP guidelines, which are for homebrew. And if you want to propose a new style for the BJCP guidelines, there are outlines of how to write it on the website, IIRC.
I understand that people will have differing opinions of what is the best example of a style, but it also seems there shouldn't be that much disparity in the parameters of a "style". I think the lines between some styles are naturally going to blur and I guess that's why I like the broader scopr of BA - I feel like it reflects what happens.

As far as new styles, the ones I'm interested in seeing are the same ones that most people know about. I am confident the BJCP is aware of the trends. If the persistence of the community hastens the approval process for a style, I might write in, otherwise I feel as though I would be beating what I'm sure is a deadhorse.
__________________
On Deck
perhaps a line of single hop IPA's - there's so many new hops out there!!!
Grizzlybrew is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-13-2010, 10:00 PM   #24
remilard
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 3,655
Liked 38 Times on 37 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grizzlybrew View Post
I didn't mean it in a bad way. I guess I meant that with the BJCP, sometimes, it seems the styles come first and are then used for homebrewers to target when they brew, whereas the BA attempts to define what exists in the market place after the styles have been brewed.
I don't think this is true at all, though feel free to quote a specific example.

The BJCP, in general, is promulgating descriptions of styles only after substantial numbers of brewers have entered them in competitions. In my time this would include IIPA and Baltic Porter. Certainly you aren't claiming that nobody was brewing these before they hit the style guidelines.
__________________
remilard is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-16-2010, 01:49 AM   #25
Grizzlybrew
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Grizzlybrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Douglasville, GA
Posts: 1,197
Liked 13 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by remilard View Post
Certainly you aren't claiming that nobody was brewing these before they hit the style guidelines.
Of course not. That would be a little ridiculous. Especially as new trends tend to develop amongst homebrewers initially.

I'm just going to shut up now and say that I prefer the wider parameters of the BA guidelines and the swiftness with which they respond to the brewing community.
__________________
On Deck
perhaps a line of single hop IPA's - there's so many new hops out there!!!
Grizzlybrew is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-16-2010, 06:07 AM   #26
Brewsmith
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Brewsmith's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 6,259
Liked 23 Times on 22 Posts

Default

One other factor in the BA/GABF categories is that those styles are fore commercial beers, where breweries have possible financial gain by winning a medal. By creating more categories, two things are accomplished:

1. More awards are given and more beers are medal winners.

2. Numbers of beers in each category entered are lower, making the competition easier to manage. That way the American IPA category doesn't have 500 entries. There are many different IPAs on the list.

English-Style India Pale Ale
American-Style Strong Pale Ale
American-Style India Pale Ale
Imperial India Pale Ale
Imperial Red Ale
American-Style India Black Ale

American Style IPA is still the largest category with 150 beers entered last year, but the number would be larger without American Strong Pale Ale, Imperial Red and India Black.

If I had to differentiate between the philosophy of the BA and BJCP, I'd say the BJCP wants to award brewers for brewing great beer to style, and the BA wants to award brewers for just making great beer.

__________________
Fermenting:#160 Apollo/Calypso Pale Ale
Kegged:#153 Old Helicon Barleywine 2013, #157 Irish Red, #158 Mosaic IPA, #159 Bravo/Delta ESB
Up Next:Brown Porter, American Stout, Imperial Stout
My Recipes
Tuba Sonata

Smith & Co. Custom Tap Handles
Brewsmith is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-16-2010, 06:20 AM   #27
Grizzlybrew
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Grizzlybrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Douglasville, GA
Posts: 1,197
Liked 13 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewsmith View Post
If I had to differentiate between the philosophy of the BA and BJCP, I'd say the BJCP wants to award brewers for brewing great beer to style, and the BA wants to award brewers for just making great beer.
I like this - it makes sense
__________________
On Deck
perhaps a line of single hop IPA's - there's so many new hops out there!!!
Grizzlybrew is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-16-2010, 06:25 AM   #28
Brewsmith
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Brewsmith's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 6,259
Liked 23 Times on 22 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grizzlybrew View Post
I like this - it makes sense
Now if I can only get my wife to say that!
__________________
Fermenting:#160 Apollo/Calypso Pale Ale
Kegged:#153 Old Helicon Barleywine 2013, #157 Irish Red, #158 Mosaic IPA, #159 Bravo/Delta ESB
Up Next:Brown Porter, American Stout, Imperial Stout
My Recipes
Tuba Sonata

Smith & Co. Custom Tap Handles
Brewsmith is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-16-2010, 12:36 PM   #29
Grizzlybrew
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Grizzlybrew's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Douglasville, GA
Posts: 1,197
Liked 13 Times on 11 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewsmith View Post
Now if I can only get my wife to say that!
It'll never happen
__________________
On Deck
perhaps a line of single hop IPA's - there's so many new hops out there!!!
Grizzlybrew is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-05-2012, 10:34 PM   #30
humann_brewing
More Humann than human
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
humann_brewing's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: the sun
Posts: 15,678
Liked 309 Times on 307 Posts
Likes Given: 18

Default

Just to revive a dead thread, I wouldn't mind seeing a 2012 or 2013 revision of the BJCP. Seems like there are lots of new styles to profile since the minor revision in 2008

__________________
humann_brewing is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cream Ale and BJCP Guidelines ejabbott General Beer Discussion 11 02-04-2012 08:30 AM
BJCP Guidelines vs. Commercial Guidelines Forbein11 General Beer Discussion 9 06-03-2010 12:33 PM
BJCP Guidelines clarification ? Trubadour General Beer Discussion 12 07-02-2009 06:35 PM
BJCP 2008 Style Guidelines TexLaw General Beer Discussion 28 03-06-2008 06:15 PM
Accuracy of BJCP guidelines vs. real examples of style? Zymurgrafi General Beer Discussion 2 12-21-2007 04:09 PM