Rubber/cardboard off-taste, good sanitation though

Tall_Yotie · 12-09-2010, 03:17 AM

Looking for advice/reasons! Help greatly appreciated.

I have done several batches, and they all turned out good. But I did a batch with my father in law, it came out tasting like cardboard/rubber (if I think hard I can make it into band-aids), and the yeast cake smelled off. There was a heat wave. Brewed with a friend. Split the batch, 2 yeasts, both with the same off flavor. Same week I brewed an IPA, yeast cake after bottling smelled just a bit off, same way. All tasted fine before bottling.

I use StarSan, and I have never had a sanitation issue. What I am confused about is that we are getting this from different brews with different yeast and different bottles of StarSan. New bottles and recycled bottles, all immersed in StarSan as I have always done. All things bottled, no kegging.

Could these flavors be due to heat? The IPA was fine temp wise, but the yeast cake smelled off. I used different fermentation vessels, so I doubt it is an issue there.

Any ideas what is going on?

Edit: 2 batches done off of well water, no chlorine. And I never use bleach.

sunblock · 12-09-2010, 03:27 AM

heatwave ... what was the ambient temp of the fermentation vessel ? depending on the yeast, low 70's can produce off flavors.

ArcaneXor · 12-09-2010, 03:29 AM

Cardboard = oxidation
Band-aids = chlorine

Fusel alcohols can sometimes taste and smell rubbery as well. If your ferm temp was high, that could be the cause.

Tall_Yotie · 12-09-2010, 03:31 AM

It got to the 90's for one of the batches, not certain about another, and I think mine with a minor smell in the yeast (haven't tasted it yet) didn't get warm.

Also, there was NO off flavor when tasting the beer right before it went into the bottles. Could these off flavors come later on and were already in the beer, or if I didn't taste it in the samples, did it have to come from bottling?

Oxidation = cardboard

Chance that then I am oxidizing it when I am bottling? I use a wand and bottling bottling, and I use a tube to go from the fermenter to the bucket. I try to keep it from splashing, but get a swirl to mix the priming sugar.

I will bottle from the primary in the next couple batches and see if it doesn't come up. Hmmm.

Keep the thoughts coming though!

sunblock · 12-09-2010, 03:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tall_Yotie

It got to the 90's for one of the batches, not certain about another, and I think mine with a minor smell in the yeast (haven't tasted it yet) didn't get warm.

Also, there was NO off flavor when tasting the beer right before it went into the bottles. Could these off flavors come later on and were already in the beer, or if I didn't taste it in the samples, did it have to come from bottling?

90s is way too high. probably lots of fusel .. made a cider like that once when the A/C went out .. one 22oz and you were stumbling around. one more and your stomach emptied. I always aim for 68 degrees or less for ales. most dry yeasts list their temp range on the packet.

Tall_Yotie · 12-09-2010, 03:43 AM

I am starting to think it was too high temp, and perhaps too much head space in the bottles.

So, if I am not tasting it in the beer before bottling, can it still come from the temps, and just be hiding? Or if it is not there before bottling, it HAS to come from the bottling?

My father in law said first off it tasted like cardboard, then thought rubber. Sounds like heat and fusel. Grrrrrr. Other than perhaps a little much head space, I can't think of what happened.

Edit: Not oxidation. Head space is fine. The heat is the culprit as far as I can tell. And the yeast cakes as i was told were indeed smelling of the off-flavor, so wasn't just introduced at the bottle. It just came out more at that point, as the samples seemed fine before.