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Old 10-09-2012, 01:05 PM   #101
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How do you convert a Kosher Jew? Give him bacon. NYUCK NYUCK NYUCK!

Getting a little heated in here. Can't we all get along? Can we at least all agree that beer is good no matter your dietary preference? Ok then. Moving right along.

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Old 10-09-2012, 01:07 PM   #102
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I understand that you insist you are referring to only "the vegans you have met", but if you don't intend for us to draw more generalized conclusions, why are you bothering to tell us at all? Is the point that we should find your friends and acquaintances intrinsically interesting?
I didn't mean to upset you. I also fail to understand why you continue to berate me with rhetorical questions. They serve no purpose but to call me out, and for no reason. They are just presumptuous means of implying that my intent was something that it surely was not.

I didn't intend for anyone to draw any generalized conclusions. I was simply partaking in the conversation. When was that disallowed? Is my perspective or experience less valid than yours? That is a serious question.
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:17 PM   #103
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This one time at lab camp I swear while I was looking at sum yeast under a scope it looked at me and smiled... oh wait, I don't think that really happened.. last thing I remember was pulling up my sacred datura for winter.
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'how will i explain this to my kids' ... if i have to ask that, then i think my kids are in trouble ... just my 2 cents ... HAVE A BEER !!!
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:35 PM   #104
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The hostility towards vegans here is pretty bizarre. Considering how marginal homebrewing in the wider world, you think we'd be a little more sympathetic to people with weird food preferences.

+1. People sure are quick to jump on the OP's back because of diet preferences. I always find it funny that certain guys like to try to declare their masculinity by what they eat. Sure sounds like overcompensation / insecurity to me.
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:43 PM   #105
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I didn't mean to upset you. I also fail to understand why you continue to berate me with rhetorical questions. They serve no purpose but to call me out, and for no reason. They are just presumptuous means of implying that my intent was something that it surely was not.

I didn't intend for anyone to draw any generalized conclusions. I was simply partaking in the conversation. When was that disallowed? Is my perspective or experience less valid than yours? That is a serious question.
Trust me when I say that I'm not "upset". I'm enjoying a cup of coffee and bouncing between my newspaper and HBT. In any case, I am now rolling my eyes, as I always do when somebody tells me that I am "upset". I'm not sure what gives you the impression that anything I am saying is an emotional response. It's trashy rhetoric, a way to dismiss someone's position without bothering to engage the substance of it. There's no need to drag things down to that. Are you upset?

More generally, I don't really go in for the "everybody's perspective is equally valid because we're all beautiful flowers" thing. No gold stars just for showing up. Your perspective is as valid as the conclusions it leads you to, no more and no less. As I keep saying, my only horse in this race is that I find it discouraging for homebrewers to buy-in to simplistic stereotyping of people with weird food interests. That same dynamic is why I don't talk about brewing beer at work. I'd be met with exactly this kind of chest-pounding ridicule. What an unpleasant fact about American culture, eh?
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:55 PM   #106
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Trust me when I say that I'm not "upset". I'm enjoying a cup of coffee and bouncing between my newspaper and HBT. In any case, I am now rolling my eyes, as I always do when somebody tells me that I am "upset". I'm not sure what gives you the impression that anything I am saying is an emotional response. It's trashy rhetoric, a way to dismiss someone's position without bothering to engage the substance of it. There's no need to drag things down to that. Are you upset?

More generally, I don't really go in for the "everybody's perspective is equally valid because we're all beautiful flowers" thing. No gold stars just for showing up. Your perspective is as valid as the conclusions it leads you to, no more and no less. As I keep saying, my only horse in this race is that I find it discouraging for homebrewers to buy-in to simplistic stereotyping of people with weird food interests. That same dynamic is why I don't talk about brewing beer at work. I'd be met with exactly this kind of chest-pounding ridicule. What an unpleasant fact about American culture, eh?
I'm just going to let you have the last word right there. You win.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:22 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MalFet View Post
Trust me when I say that I'm not "upset". I'm enjoying a cup of coffee and bouncing between my newspaper and HBT. In any case, I am now rolling my eyes, as I always do when somebody tells me that I am "upset". I'm not sure what gives you the impression that anything I am saying is an emotional response. It's trashy rhetoric, a way to dismiss someone's position without bothering to engage the substance of it. There's no need to drag things down to that. Are you upset?

More generally, I don't really go in for the "everybody's perspective is equally valid because we're all beautiful flowers" thing. No gold stars just for showing up. Your perspective is as valid as the conclusions it leads you to, no more and no less. As I keep saying, my only horse in this race is that I find it discouraging for homebrewers to buy-in to simplistic stereotyping of people with weird food interests. That same dynamic is why I don't talk about brewing beer at work. I'd be met with exactly this kind of chest-pounding ridicule. What an unpleasant fact about American culture, eh?
Don't look now, but you're engaging in it.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:23 PM   #108
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...hard-core paleo dieters? ... crossfit box 3-4 times a week...
Doing crossfit on hard-core paleo would be tough. I think most of those guys are "primal" not paleo, meaning they ingest small amounts of tuber-type carbs (i.e., potatoes). Ketones are great, but glucose really helps with the high intensity stuff.


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...I think ignorance plays a large part in this thinking. What does meat provide that a vegetarian diet does not?
I've been doing some research on this, and I've found the evidence pretty compelling in favor of meat. Grass fad, pasture quality meat, not feed-lot, corn-fed garbage. I think a lot of the paleo/primal stuff is very fad-like, almost cult-like, but some of the research is extremely compelling.

Here's some reading I found interesting: (it's on the internet, it has to be true...)
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread67217.html
http://garytaubes.com/2012/03/scienc...logy-and-meat/
http://nuclearfuzzgrunge.com/tlcm/


Again, I'm not pushing ideology here, just fostering discussion. I wholly affirm that we, the human race, don't know everything and there is no dietary silver bullet that cures all ails...Adam's curse prevails. And, my respect for you is not contingent upon your dietary choices.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:28 PM   #109
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Doing crossfit on hard-core paleo would be tough. I think most of those guys are "primal" not paleo, meaning they ingest small amounts of tuber-type carbs (i.e., potatoes). Ketones are great, but glucose really helps with the high intensity stuff.




I've been doing some research on this, and I've found the evidence pretty compelling in favor of meat. Grass fad, pasture quality meat, not feed-lot, corn-fed garbage. I think a lot of the paleo/primal stuff is very fad-like, almost cult-like, but some of the research is extremely compelling.

Here's some reading I found interesting:
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread67217.html
http://garytaubes.com/2012/03/scienc...logy-and-meat/
http://nuclearfuzzgrunge.com/tlcm/


Again, I'm not pushing ideology here, just fostering discussion. I wholly affirm that we, the human race, don't know everything and there is no dietary silver bullet that cures all ails...Adam's curse prevails. And, my respect for you is not contingent upon your dietary choices.
Oh, he's hard-core Paleo alright. If a cave man couldn't pick it or kill it, he won't eat it. He'll let himself have a "free" day every month so he can partake in a family dinner or a couple of "normal" beers (i.e. made with grain). I tried doing a modified version of the diet, but that didn't last long.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:38 PM   #110
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Oh, he's hard-core Paleo alright. If a cave man couldn't pick it or kill it, he won't eat it. I tried doing a modified version of the diet, but that didn't last long.
Again, that sounds like primal, but the distinction is pretty minimal.

Most modified versions don't last long. If you're still ingesting carbs/glucose, you kinda get stuck in "no man's" land where you're not getting enough glucose to function at 100%, but not yet adapted to burning fat, so you feel sluggish, tired, headachey, terrible. Not pushing you one way or the other, but you really have to commit to it to feel the benefits, whatever they may be.
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