Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Beer Discussion > Hop Utilization with a hop sock

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-11-2013, 02:11 AM   #1
HellBound
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: West Hills, CA
Posts: 334
Liked 99 Times on 67 Posts

Default Hop Utilization with a hop sock

So I've recently noticed a slightly diminished utilization in my beers. I know that I should see that with the use of the bag in my boil, but how much less are we talking?

Case in point, I have a house amber that normally has a clean hop crispness. These last 2 batches of it, it seems like it's in the background of the beer.

__________________
PRIMARY NightHawk IIPA
SECONDARY Shut Your Face IPA
BOTTLED Unlucky 13 Irish Red
HellBound is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 03:39 AM   #2
IXVolt
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
IXVolt's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Oregon
Posts: 1,730
Liked 78 Times on 53 Posts
Likes Given: 76

Default

The other factor is the freshness of the hops you are using. Are they stored in a freezer? as little air as possible to them? Sunlight? etc.

__________________
IXVolt is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 03:43 AM   #3
HellBound
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: West Hills, CA
Posts: 334
Liked 99 Times on 67 Posts

Default

I brew the day I get them from my LHBS and they are in freezer there. I know that would play a role, but considering that's where I always source all my product, I doubt much. I think it's really a matter of the hop sock.

Kinda wondering if there's some known ratio to expect for losses. Like .75 oz gets used for every 1 oz boiled with a mesh sock

__________________
PRIMARY NightHawk IIPA
SECONDARY Shut Your Face IPA
BOTTLED Unlucky 13 Irish Red
HellBound is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 12:25 PM   #4
naga77777
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Oxford, NC
Posts: 440
Liked 53 Times on 45 Posts
Likes Given: 646

Default

Well, carp.

I Just brewed an IPA, and thought "i'm gonna use a muslin bag to control all this pellet hop gunk that usually eats a beer or two due to trub loss." Overheard a LHBS employee recommend the practice.

Had never occurred that I'd lose utilization. Not a good thing with an IPA.

interested to hear some other opinions; subscribed.

__________________
Brewing Since July 2012 All-grain BIAB
Primary 1: Raging Irish Red
Primary 2: Lilsparky's Nut Brown Ale
Secondary 1: Skeeter Pee
Secondary 2: Air
Kegged: Two Hearted Clone, Graff, BM Centennial Blonde (again :) )
naga77777 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 12:41 PM   #5
Fennis
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Readfield, Maine
Posts: 384
Liked 25 Times on 18 Posts
Likes Given: 4

Default

You know what? Now that I think about it, I've made a few of the same pale ale batches using Brewer's Gold hops. The first two times I brewed it, I didn't use a hop sock and it had a nice sharp bite to it. The last time I brewed it, the hops were mellowed out and not nearly as sharp, but I used a hop sock, and I was wondering if I had done something wrong or didn't use as many hops, but its always been a kit recipe so everything gets measured out for me. You may have something there...

__________________
Fennis is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 01:50 PM   #6
Xpertskir
Feedback Score: 6 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Morgantown, Wv
Posts: 2,018
Liked 379 Times on 248 Posts
Likes Given: 21

Default

I think far too many people run and use a device to quarantine their hop matter.

IMO you should have a reason to do this, not "just because". Its beyond proven that hop matter in your fermenter will not do any harm to the beer.
If you are using a plate chiller or piece of equipment in your process that is sensitive to particulate in your wort, then by all means you should be doing something to make that piece of equipment function better(this has actually lead me to avoid such products, and I use a chiller in this vein).

There will be people on here that argue there is no difference in utilization, but I have yet to see that backed up with lab testing. Id rather KISS and not create a potential problem for myself by doing more work.

I personally use a strainer when sending my wort to the fermenter which does an adequate job. The only reason I do it is that I would rather my fermenter hold wort than hop matter.


Also OP, those hops from the HBS were all harvested at the same time, and regardless of how cold they are stored they will lose something as time goes on. You were likely brewing with last years harvest, depending on the hops you used.

__________________
Xpertskir is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 04:06 PM   #7
badhabit
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Evanston Wyoming
Posts: 721
Liked 11 Times on 11 Posts

Default

There have been tons of threads on the use or avoiding the use of the hops bag. At one point a number of years ago I tried brewing an APA splitting the batch between use of the bag and no bag. I couldn't taste a notable difference and my family members were unable to tell any difference at all. Not what I would call science but my clean up is easier ever since.

__________________
badhabit is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 05:51 PM   #8
unionrdr
Wannabe author
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
unionrdr's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Sheffield, Ohio
Posts: 28,617
Liked 1949 Times on 1708 Posts
Likes Given: 1442

Default

Same here,no real big difference,quite minor. I even saw a vid where NB still had hops for sale from 2010. They by so much,it sits around for a while. I like the hop bags,less mess & if you don't put more than one ounce in it,it should flow fine. I also strain going into the FV.
__________________
Everything works if ya let it-Roady(meatloaf)
My new book is on Amazon Kindle! http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00L3MCU0W
unionrdr is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 06:34 PM   #9
HellBound
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: West Hills, CA
Posts: 334
Liked 99 Times on 67 Posts

Default

First off thanks for the replies.

After reviewing my process on those last 2 batches, I think it's because I added all hop additions in the same hop sack. Versus a few different sacks throughout the boil. It maybe a little extra to clean, but I feel it balances out with strain time. I strain before FV also, but it's easier without all the hop sludge in the kettle.

Strange how it took me 2 years of brewing to notice a difference.

__________________
PRIMARY NightHawk IIPA
SECONDARY Shut Your Face IPA
BOTTLED Unlucky 13 Irish Red
HellBound is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 07:12 PM   #10
daksin
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
daksin's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 4,095
Liked 272 Times on 238 Posts
Likes Given: 323

Default

I don't see any intuitive reason a bag should reduce hop utilization. After a few minutes in boiling wort (and the temperature isn't any different inside the bag) 100% of the oils and other compounds we're looking for should be totally extracted and dispersed throughout the wort. After that, who cares where the vegetable matter is?

That said, if you're using tons of LEAF hops and you get a big ball of hops that doesn't get even access to the boiling wort, sure, you could miss out on some utilization due to the slower extraction of oils, but that's just a matter of not using a big enough bag.

Does anybody have any good data on this? I've seen the 5% number tossed around, so that must have come from somewhere.

__________________

I can't be arsed to keep up this list of what's in the fermenters, but hey, check out the cool brewery I own!

twitter.com/2kidsbrewing .. facebook.com/2kidsbrewing .. 2kidsbrewing.com

daksin is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Forgot Hop Sock Diaperload Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 6 09-22-2011 05:16 PM
Hop Sock Utilization? tonyolympia Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 6 06-02-2011 10:06 PM
Hops in Hop Sock IPAman All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 3 05-27-2010 12:11 AM
Hop Sock Variation Simphoto02 DIY Projects 9 01-02-2010 02:42 PM
Hop Sock impact? BigdogMark Extract Brewing 9 08-10-2009 12:10 AM