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Old 03-06-2014, 04:58 PM   #51
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BTW, I'm not figuring out what I've spent on homebrew equipment. I don't want my wife to find out.
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That is awesome. Incrementalism can be useful for us, eh?
If I were to try to factor in marital stress, I'd NEVER get a positive ROI!
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Old 03-06-2014, 05:15 PM   #52
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As a newish home brewer/engineer/guy that loves to spend money on cool stuff, I was just wondering how much you guys think you have spent on brew kettles, carboys, fancy ferment chambers, kegs, keezers, etc and how many bottles of beer you have made.

I really enjoy making my own beer (or other adult beverages) but i'm thinking it will be a while until it starts to pay off financially . . .
If you're thinking about ROI, you're doing it all wrong Initially, it seems like it might be possible, but as you get more involved and interested in trying to make better beer, all that thought about saving money goes out the window!

This doesn't even count the disproportionate amount of money you'll spend on "just trying" other craft brews! I've spent more on beer after starting brewing, than I ever did before I knew how to make it.
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Old 03-06-2014, 05:41 PM   #53
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Does it make you happy? Do you make others happy with your hobby? You sure do. The hobby itself is priceless. You are going to lose money no matter what on a hobby unless your hobby is day trading and you are good at it. Sure I have spent more money on this hobby than it has brought in but I also have awards and medals that are worth more to me. With this hobby I have also gathered historical knowledge and so much more. Most of all, the camaraderie of fellow homebrewers.

On top of that, brewing beers I like to drink and learning about different ingredients including lately the importance of water. I have made dumpers and I have made batches that go so fast, you wonder where they went. Most of all, variety.

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Old 03-06-2014, 05:51 PM   #54
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Also have to factor in the tasty dog treats from the spent grain.

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Old 03-06-2014, 05:57 PM   #55
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Make a couple batches of wine for SWMBO, the "profit" margin is greater.

Also sometimes its good to have women hanging around your bar too

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Old 03-06-2014, 06:08 PM   #56
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I'm certainly at a negative ROI at this particular point in my journey, although in the next year or so, I expect to have monetarily broken even.

It seems like most people are posting from places with relatively modest alcohol taxes. Here in Ontario, it's scary easy to drop $15 on a six pack of okay but not amazing craft brews. The cheapest non-BMC brews are $2/500 ml can.

Since ingredient prices are basically the same as the US (and not-taxed, which "saves" me 13%), there is a huge price difference between a home brew batch and a commercial craft brew.

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Old 03-06-2014, 06:24 PM   #57
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I made it a goal to spend less than if I had bought similar beer, so I keep track of everything (equipment, ingredients, cleaning supplies). It doesn't take long to meet this goal, if you want. Note that this is fun to me and not a chore. My setup is all grain (often home-roasting my own specialty grains) > corona mill > BIAB in a turkey fryer pot > ferment in a better bottle (swamp cooler as needed) > bottle (and I love it).

Current running cost per 12 oz bottle produced: $1.20 (lets call that conservatively $0.30 per bottle saved)

Amount saved by doing this instead of something else with my time: lots and lots

I figure that even I "break even", I've had a lot of fun doing it and I've taken up a lot of time that could have gone toward costly hobbies. In fact, I don't like the term "hobbies" very much. I drink beer, so I brew it. I eat food, so I grow it. I like music so I play it. I play music so I make musical instruments.

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Old 03-06-2014, 06:27 PM   #58
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If you are worried about the ROI on homebrewing... Never buy a boat, a plane, a gun, a fast car, a Ring, a Wife, a kid I'm sure I could go on.

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Old 03-06-2014, 06:48 PM   #59
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I don't think you can break even. The most obvious - ingredients. Sure I can break even or get ahead. Ok now include equipment, and energy cost (elect or propane) and lastly that element that is impossible to over come - TIME. Never ever will I get ahead, unless I start making something to compare to a Westvlentren 12.

I could discount the time saying "if I weren't brewing I'd other hobby for $$$ or waste on video games or such" so sure the time I make beer isn't saving/making me money if I do something else with it.

I could also discount the equipment saying "if I have a hobby it will have gear which will cost...."

And I could just compare buying ingredients to buying beer - ok, then I'm ahead on every batch.

But the most important ROI is I can make what I want and not have to look for it. I can make a lemon wine (skeeterpee.com) and I can't buy that. I can make a dark wheat which I can't find to buy. so from that pov, the return is priceless. I may make a beer that the rest of the world hates, but if I love it, I've won. I make the beer for my consumption, not for a nation of 300 million (paging BMC)

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Old 03-06-2014, 08:51 PM   #60
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This prompted me to try to actually calculate my ROI. My household consumes alot of beer, so this is all assuming anything brewed would have otherwise been purchased. I'm sure I left some things out (please let me know if you notice anything wrong), but the results, (if my math is correct) are quite surprising.

Equipment
Megapot 15 Gallon Kettle $200
New Immersion chiller $100
Old 8 Gallon Kettle$50
Old Immersion Chiller$50
Upcycled Mash Tun$40
Bayou Burner$50
Initial Extract Equipment Kit$70

Refractometer$50
2 Glass Carboys$80
2 Plastic Carboys$40
4 Bungs & airlocks$8
Crappy Thermometers$50
Thermoworks Thermometer$60

2 Kegs$120
Co2 Tank$85
Co2 Regulator & Splitter$70
Tap Tower$180
Mini Refridgerator$100
38DD Fermentation Chamber$120
Yeast Stirplate$30

Propane & Co2 Refills$100
Various Acessories$100

TOTAL Investment:<$1,760
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Savings/ROI on 1 year of 6 gal batch brewing

Average 6 gallon AG Recipe Cost:$30
Average 12 oz homebrewed beer cost:$0.50

Average 6 gallon craft beer cost:$90
Average 12 oz craft beer cost:$1.50

Savings per batch:$60

Batches per year:36

Savings per year:$2160

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Savings/ROI on 1 year of 10 gal batch brewing
(upgraded to 10-12 gal setup in 2014)
Average 10 gallon AG Recipe Cost:$50
Average 12 oz homebrewed beer cost:$0.50

Average 6 gallon craft beer cost:$150
Average 12 oz craft beer cost:$1.50

Savings per batch:$100

Batches per year:36

Savings per year:$3600
I think this is a good starting point. The one thing that can only be assessed individually is putting a $ amount on your time to get a full perspective. Without doing that your not really considering all the factors. If your someone that makes a lot of money and your time isn't cheap then its cheaper to buy beer. Any savings you made brewing wouldnt outweigh your losses had you spent that time working. Now say you make $10/hr after taxes, then the savings you netted brewing your own equals out to the amount you could have made working that same amount of time, assuming your brewday is 6 hrs. You break even.

To sum it up... The more you drink and the lower your hourly wage the better your ROI. Am I missing something here?
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