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Old 02-23-2012, 03:49 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
I just read an article a few days ago that they are about to certify another Trappist Brewery.

Here's the only decent mention I can find without more time to search:

http://brookstonbeerbulletin.com/the...ppist-brewery/
Yep, I saw that too.

Another link: http://mybeerbuzz.blogspot.com/2012/...n-austria.html
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Old 02-23-2012, 03:52 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by IffyG View Post
Call me crazy, but a decoction in it's simplest form is removing some of the wort and heating it up...
Aren't you supposed to take a portion of the mash and heat it up? As in, not just the wort, but the grains too...
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Old 02-23-2012, 04:48 PM   #13
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Yes a decoction is removing a portion of mash, not wort

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Old 02-23-2012, 04:55 PM   #14
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Yes a decoction is removing a portion of mash, not wort
The purpose of the decoction is to raise the temp of the mash without adding any further liquid. It's possible to do this by using just the wort if the mash is thin enough. But for many brewers, you won't get enough wort (it's trapped in grain) to change the temp enough to get to the next rest. Since there is nothing wrong with boiling the low pH mash, most brewers just pull both grain and wort - and then avoid having to lauter.
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Old 02-23-2012, 04:59 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by IffyG View Post
Call me crazy, but a decoction in it's simplest form is removing some of the wort and heating it up...
That's a thin decoction, though, and is only used for mashout steps so far as I know. A "real" decoction is removing the thick part of the mash.


The reasoning is that by removing the thick portion you are leaving most of the liquid behind, which has all the enzymes responsible for converting starches. When you remove the liquid and heat it up to boiling, you are denaturing the enzymes. For a thick decoction this is not a problem because there are plenty of enzymes left in the liquid in the mash tun, but for a thin decoction this could be a significant portion of the enzymes. Since the purpose of the mash out step is to denature those enzymes anyway, it makes sense to do a thin decoction for that.
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Old 02-23-2012, 06:14 PM   #16
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Well they got the lambic almost right... Exept the fruit part

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Old 02-23-2012, 06:38 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by weirdboy View Post
That's a thin decoction, though, and is only used for mashout steps so far as I know. A "real" decoction is removing the thick part of the mash.


The reasoning is that by removing the thick portion you are leaving most of the liquid behind, which has all the enzymes responsible for converting starches. When you remove the liquid and heat it up to boiling, you are denaturing the enzymes. For a thick decoction this is not a problem because there are plenty of enzymes left in the liquid in the mash tun, but for a thin decoction this could be a significant portion of the enzymes. Since the purpose of the mash out step is to denature those enzymes anyway, it makes sense to do a thin decoction for that.
I guess I don't see most of those points as being true misinformation, aside from the darker beers are stronger bit. The other stuff it seems to be outdated (the number of Trappist Breweries), sort of correct (decoction) or gives a mostly correct perception of the style they name (lambic).

Given the context of the WSET, it's close enough for their needs...
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Old 02-23-2012, 06:42 PM   #18
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The Trappist info isn't outdated, just trivially mistaken. It's been 7 forever (relax. "forever" is used figuratively).

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Old 02-23-2012, 08:35 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by IffyG View Post
I guess I don't see most of those points as being true misinformation, aside from the darker beers are stronger bit. The other stuff it seems to be outdated (the number of Trappist Breweries), sort of correct (decoction) or gives a mostly correct perception of the style they name (lambic).

Given the context of the WSET, it's close enough for their needs...
I look at it as pretty big misinformation.

For one, most people would agree that a decoction mash consists of removing part of the grain along with some of the liquid and boiling.

Also I think that if information is more than five years out-dated... it's safe to call it bad information.

And how is that a mostly correct perception of the style lambic? Sure lambics are made with wheat and some are made with fruit but when you think lambic do you consider those two to be it's defining characteristics? I highly doubt it.

I should note that the training materials weren't actually provided from the WSET at all. Rather this is a group of training modules put together by the vendor to prep their own employees for the WSET.
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Old 02-23-2012, 08:43 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Homebrewtastic View Post
I look at it as pretty big misinformation.

For one, most people would agree that a decoction mash consists of removing part of the grain along with some of the liquid and boiling.

Also I think that if information is more than five years out-dated... it's safe to call it bad information.

And how is that a mostly correct perception of the style lambic? Sure lambics are made with wheat and some are made with fruit but when you think lambic do you consider those two to be it's defining characteristics? I highly doubt it.

I should note that the training materials weren't actually provided from the WSET at all. Rather this is a group of training modules put together by the vendor to prep their own employees for the WSET.
You mean a raspberry weizen isn't a kind of lambic?

And I agree on pretty much all points.
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