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Old 12-03-2012, 05:53 PM   #381
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So, the 7 micro/nanobreweries in my town, all of whom sell beer commercially to local pubs, as well as directly to the public from their retail counter (some of whom even sell through the local liquor stores), are not "commercial?"

Then how do we distinguish between licensed, multi-bbl operations brewing it for profit, and homebrewers brewing it for fun?

To add to the topic, I'd have to say the most bizarre (I guess maybe funny?) thing I've heard about beer is when I've offered a homebrew to a guest, and they say, "No thanks, I don't like beer."

Huh? What do you mean you "don't like beer?" There are hundreds of different kinds of beer. "I just don't like the taste." Which taste? That's like offering someone a slice of almond hazelnut cheesecake and them replying that they "don't like cake" because they once had a slice of a lemon watermelon poundcake that they didn't like.

In those situations, is it worth it to try and educate them about all the different kinds of beer, and encouraging them to try some variety to see the differences? Or do you just decide they're probably a lost cause and let it go?
Correct. I will contend humorously and erroneously, but in all earnesty, that the homebrewer as well as the microbreweries in your home town, unless they have commercials on television or radio, should be considered non-commercial beers. Here's my thinking:

We want to encourage good beer. Part of having good beer is that it be local. This leads to a fresher product, a hometown flavor, and hey, less shipping is good for the environment as well. This also supports local jobs and the local economy. And these brewers have more in common than you might think. Brewers without a large marketing arm are not competing on the basis of coolness or popularity, only on taste. What I make in my kitchen, and what 2 Brothers or 3 Floyds make in their brewery is all about taste and flavor. So when it comes to what matters, lumping these groups with homebrewers makes sense. After all, if the homebrewer can't make beer approaching that good, then he might as well just buy craft beer.

But now... what to call this collection of homebrewers, microbrewers, and nanobrewers? What catch-all can we use? What do they all have in common? Well, they don't have commercials. They rely on their reputation for quality, and good word of mouth, rather than commercials. So, they are all non-commercial.

LOL
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:01 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Sir Humpsalot View Post
Correct. I will contend humorously and erroneously, but in all earnesty, that the homebrewer as well as the microbreweries in your home town, unless they have commercials on television or radio, should be considered non-commercial beers. Here's my thinking:

We want to encourage good beer. Part of having good beer is that it be local. This leads to a fresher product, a hometown flavor, and hey, less shipping is good for the environment as well. This also supports local jobs and the local economy. And these brewers have more in common than you might think. Brewers without a large marketing arm are not competing on the basis of coolness or popularity, only on taste. What I make in my kitchen, and what 2 Brothers or 3 Floyds make in their brewery is all about taste and flavor. So when it comes to what matters, lumping these groups with homebrewers makes sense. After all, if the homebrewer can't make beer approaching that good, then he might as well just buy craft beer.

But now... what to call this collection of homebrewers, microbrewers, and nanobrewers? What catch-all can we use? What do they all have in common? Well, they don't have commercials. They rely on their reputation for quality, and good word of mouth, rather than commercials. So, they are all non-commercial.

LOL
Commercial doesn't necessarily require advertising though. Part of their marketing is their storefront/brewpub, their beer names, their stylistic choice, the vibe that they give off. Cambridge Brewing Company for example doesn't advertise, and they do make excellent beer and strive to use lots of local ingredients, but certainly a part of the appeal is coolness and popularity along with the general feel they've created around their products.

Plus, I've been to many a brewpub that makes crappy beer that's not all about taste and flavor, they corner a piece of the market and sell cheap beer to rake in a profit. Sometimes it's not even fresh product. What should we call those establishments in your renaming paradigm? You can't assume that "can't afford/doesn't want television advertisements" means "makes high quality craft beer".
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:12 PM   #383
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Commercial doesn't necessarily require advertising though. Part of their marketing is their storefront/brewpub, their beer names, their stylistic choice, the vibe that they give off. Cambridge Brewing Company for example doesn't advertise, and they do make excellent beer and strive to use lots of local ingredients, but certainly a part of the appeal is coolness and popularity along with the general feel they've created around their products.

Plus, I've been to many a brewpub that makes crappy beer that's not all about taste and flavor, they corner a piece of the market and sell cheap beer to rake in a profit. Sometimes it's not even fresh product. What should we call those establishments in your renaming paradigm? You can't assume that "can't afford/doesn't want television advertisements" means "makes high quality craft beer".
Good question. Hmmmm... I guess I would label them as Failures. But I'm open to other names. Maybe there should be a name that encompasses the types of establishments of which you speak and also the faux-craft beers like Blue Moon and Shock Top. Just call them knock-offs maybe?
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:43 AM   #384
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There are no businesses that truly do not advertise themselves or have no commercials. Such would go out of business quickly. Those successful establishments that "do not advertise" have a reputation that advertises for them. It is carried--instead of on airwaves, billboards or flyers--upon the loving lips of their clientele. However, the reputation had to be earned. The branding had to be done. The love of their clients must be won in each and every glass along with each and every detail of their business model. The difference between a commercial endeavor and a hobbyist doing the same thing is that one does it solely for the love of doing it; the other may love it, but also wants to profit from it.

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Old 12-04-2012, 01:24 PM   #385
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There are no businesses that truly do not advertise themselves or have no commercials. Such would go out of business quickly. Those successful establishments that "do not advertise" have a reputation that advertises for them. It is carried--instead of on airwaves, billboards or flyers--upon the loving lips of their clientele. However, the reputation had to be earned. The branding had to be done. The love of their clients must be won in each and every glass along with each and every detail of their business model. The difference between a commercial endeavor and a hobbyist doing the same thing is that one does it solely for the love of doing it; the other may love it, but also wants to profit from it.
Saw an hour long video of Sam Calagione when he was doing a presentation at Google. He made th claim that Dog Fish Head doesn't advertise.

Bull****.

He's doing interviews, took part in a reality TV show, wrote a (very hohum) book, promoted said book, was in a beer documentary movie, have a company run YouTube channel with almost a million views. Etc etc.

Wtf do you call that? I call it promotion and advertising.

Stone's Greg Koch makes the same claim. I guess unless you sponsor a nascar team you haven't advertised.

Somehow advertising is bad. Sam Adams isn't the #3 brewing company in America and the largest American owned brewery in America because their beer is so good. They advertise.
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:31 PM   #386
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I liked Stone on Facebook. They have an advertisement everyday on there.

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Old 12-04-2012, 03:08 PM   #387
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Sam Adams isn't the #3 brewing company in America and the largest American owned brewery in America because their beer is so good. They advertise.

Yuengling pushed them out a while ago, despite having a distribution limited to, I believe, 13 states (and only 2 brewery sites) versus Boston Beer's national distribution and contract brewing.
To lend support to your argument, however, they took that title after they started buying more TV ads throughout their market rather than their old faithful word of mouth (which had made them the second largest American owned brewery)
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Old 12-04-2012, 03:09 PM   #388
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I don't know if it's funny in the US, but the first time I head "I don't like beer, I only drink lager", I did find it quite curious. I've heard it now hundreds of times so it lacks the novelty.

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Old 12-04-2012, 04:45 PM   #389
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A couple of days ago at a local bottle shop I was looking for some good sours and lambics that I could harvest the dregs from. A couple of frat guys and a girl walk up nearby and the girl picks up a Hanssens Raspberry.

Girl: How about some of these fruit beers?
Guy: That s**t is just b**** beer that tastes like a wine cooler, I want something really heavy like Guinness.

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Old 12-04-2012, 05:19 PM   #390
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I don't know if it's funny in the US, but the first time I head "I don't like beer, I only drink lager", I did find it quite curious. I've heard it now hundreds of times so it lacks the novelty.
Check it:
http://m.wisegeek.org/what-is-the-difference-between-beer-and-ale.htm

News to me, but apparently people follow the distinction listed on that website.
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