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Old 12-03-2012, 03:52 PM   #171
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...and even if 'scientifically' (or maybe more correctly, analytically) you can detect a difference chemically - that may not equate with being able to detect a difference sensorially. And you may be able to detect a difference where I may not - we all have differing abilities regarding taste & smell.

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Old 12-03-2012, 04:29 PM   #172
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Originally Posted by Golddiggie View Post
There are times when you also want kettle caramelization of the wort. A longer boil will give that to you
See, here's one to correct right now...caramelization doesn't happen until 360F and you'll never hit that in a kettle full of wort.
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Old 12-03-2012, 04:34 PM   #173
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The best thing to do is to take information, ANY INFORMATION, in and try it for yourself.
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Old 12-03-2012, 04:38 PM   #174
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[QUOTE=Rev2010;4644219People say decoction creates melanoidins for example.[/QUOTE]

Keep in mind that melanoidins are a color, not a flavor.

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Old 12-03-2012, 04:59 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Denny View Post
See, here's one to correct right now...caramelization doesn't happen until 360F and you'll never hit that in a kettle full of wort.
I'd love to see more analytical information about this - but google didn't turn up much more than forum discussions.

There is typically some color effect of a longer boil based on contact with the surface that the burner has direct contact with (I suspect from maillard vs. caramelization) - which is generally the reason to turn off the burner when adding liquid extract I believe.
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:14 PM   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BulldogBrewer View Post
I'd love to see more analytical information about this - but google didn't turn up much more than forum discussions.

There is typically some color effect of a longer boil based on contact with the surface that the burner has direct contact with (I suspect from maillard vs. caramelization) - which is generally the reason to turn off the burner when adding liquid extract I believe.
I'm not 100% sure, but I think the issue with extract is that it's not completely in solution, so you're actually scalding solid/not quite in solution material. In a 100% water solution there shouldn't be caramelization (MAYBE as you said there's some at the bottom of the kettle), but in a syrup/heated solid you'll definitely get some sort of caramelization/maillard reactions.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:10 PM   #177
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Keep in mind that melanoidins are a color, not a flavor.
Yes, but those melanoidins generally occur as a result of the maillard reaction, and I think it's safe to suggest where you find a change in colour you're probably also likely to find a change in flavour. The degree of change may be very subtle, but still.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:43 PM   #178
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Yes, but those melanoidins generally occur as a result of the maillard reaction, and I think it's safe to suggest where you find a change in colour you're probably also likely to find a change in flavour. The degree of change may be very subtle, but still.
I pretty much agree with you, but I wanted to point out that it's not the melanoidins themselves that create flavor. Most homebrewers don't realize that.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:34 PM   #179
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Anti -litical establishmentarianism: If Palmer ever wrote it, Do it!



If you try something that takes some time and cannot tell the difference, then do not do it unless you think it makes your process better.



Home brewing reminds me of what we said the USAF:

1. Measure with a micromometer.
2. Mark with a grease pencil.
3. Cut with an ax.

I had a Chemistry minor and likely there are changes that could be detected in different procedures. It may not however be detectable on YOUR palette.

I remember years ago National Geo had a smell test in one of the issues. My son and I smelled candy, SWMBO said it smelled like urine.

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Old 12-04-2012, 01:11 PM   #180
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One big thing I learned over my limited brewing time that contradicted the standard brewing view was that you don't need to chill your wort to a pitchable temp as quickly as possible. From my initial readings and talking to home brew employees they stressed the importance of chilling and how important wort chillers were in the process. From what I've read people in Australia have been doing the no chill method for years so I gave it a shot on my last 4 batches and must say I cannot tell a difference in the outcome!

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