Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Beer Discussion > Canning Homebrew?

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-06-2012, 05:27 AM   #11
djfriesen
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,144
Liked 19 Times on 18 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgilmore View Post
To the guy who wants to use mason jars, go for it. I would never myself because I both brew and process pickled stuff and the principals are different with each. But hey, knock yourself out.
Bolded for Truth. You are free to try, but be aware that you are much more likely to get bottle bombs with mason jars. The pressure differential is exactly opposite between canning and bottle conditioning. Mason jars are not designed to withstand a positive internal pressure, where champagne and beer bottles are.

Plenty of people will say that they've done it plenty of times with no problems. But with as cheap as a case of good, fliptop-bottled, craft beer is, why run the risk?

Sorry for the detour. Back On-topic: That's a great idea. I have read that the most prohibitive aspects to canning are the equipment cost and the bulk nature of supply availability. This business would make both of these aspects of production manageable, for a small fee, of course. The business owner buys cans in bulk, carries the equipment around, and charges you a percentage markup to use some of his cans (maybe a sliding scale cost-point depending on quantity purchased?). Bottom line, it seems he's identified a need and found a potentially profitable way to meet that need. Props to him/her.

That said, I don't produce enough to make it viable, I don't think. I have a pretty stable supply of bottles, and I can't see wanting to pay more to package it differently.
__________________
djfriesen is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 05:40 AM   #12
emjay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
emjay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 12,694
Liked 1712 Times on 1601 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

It would be awesome if a large LHBS - or even BOP - could bring this service to the (local) homebrew market. Bring in a fully carbed keg or several, pay a per-graphic setup fee, and a per-can filling/printing fee, and pick it up when it's done. I could see myself paying $2-3 per tallboy for really special batches, though it'd have to be a bit cheaper (~$1.50, maybe?) to do it on a more regular basis. I'd probably put everything in cans if it could be done for $1/tallboy or $75¢/12oz can.

__________________
emjay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 05:42 AM   #13
CBXBob
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
CBXBob's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Grants Pass/ Nuevo, Or. / Ca.
Posts: 420
Liked 75 Times on 48 Posts
Likes Given: 161

Default

If I was doing 20 gallon batches, and the cost of canning was .05 per can. 128 oz per gal. X 20 =2560 oz divided by 12 oz =213 cans X $.05 =$10.66, yeah I's go for it
Might even go for $.10 per can, any more than that and I'm out!

__________________
CBXBob is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 05:51 AM   #14
mikescooling
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,641
Liked 204 Times on 155 Posts
Likes Given: 185

Default

Hey guys, I thinks some us are talking about canning in mason jar and others in steel cans. When I was little, 1982 dad opened his beer with a "church-key". I'd buy steel canned beer, just to back in time.

__________________
mikescooling is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 08:57 AM   #15
emjay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
emjay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 12,694
Liked 1712 Times on 1601 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBXBob
If I was doing 20 gallon batches, and the cost of canning was .05 per can. 128 oz per gal. X 20 =2560 oz divided by 12 oz =213 cans X $.05 =$10.66, yeah I's go for it
Might even go for $.10 per can, any more than that and I'm out!
Yeah, you'd never get anywhere near that price for a small batch like that. That's the kind of cost a brewery with *their own* canning equipment might see.

10¢/unit is what people "pay" here just by keeping used bottles (since that's the deposit you'd otherwise get back). Hell, you could probably even manage to turn in printed cans for that refund (not exactly legally, but it'd be easy to get away with), making it free - or even profitable - at the prices you stated. Which actually also suggests that even big breweries pay at least a little more than that. In fact, a business that cans homebrew here would probably only be allowed to operate, assuming it'd EVER be allowed, if they charged the same deposit on the cans of homebrew.

To get totally custom cans made and filled for that price is just never going to happen. It's so far outside the realm of realistic that even just mentioning such prices is ridiculous... pure fantasy.
__________________
emjay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 09:08 AM   #16
grndslm
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 228
Liked 22 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
You'd have to bulk carbonate it. Either that, or drink it nearly flat. I suppose they technically COULD make special "jars" that could withstand the pressure from bottle-conditioning, but they wouldn't even look like regular mason jars, unless they used ridiculously thick glass.
Bulk priming is the ONLY way to go, regardless of what I'm bottling/canning in. We're currently using 5-oz of sugar for our 5-gal batches, and it could be just a TAD on the high side.

I'm willing to bet that if we switched to 3-oz of sugar for our 5-gal batches to go into STANDARD mason jars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
Either way, you'd be paying a heck of a premium on them and they wouldn't be cheaper than using standard beer bottles, as it'd both be smaller-scale manufacturing and require more glass per vessel. And because of that, I don't see why there would be much of a demand for such a product, making it all the more expensive to actually produce. Which kind of sucks now that I think about it, as I think it'd be fun to "bottle" a Kentucky common or even a CAP.
STANDARD mason jars could be had for incredibly reasonable prices at ANY grocery store in the world....

Twelve - 32 ounce mason jars with INFINITELY reusable lids... for $11

Two of those 12-packs for $22 total, and then you're good for repeating a 5-gal batch FOR LIFE [or at least the life of the glass].

That's "better" than me having to drive to another state where I can buy empty bottles, or paying $2.75 for a 22-oz of Sam Adams. Twenty-nine 22-oz bottles (enough for a 5-gal batch) of Sam Adams would cost $80. And THEN one would still need a capper, and would need to continually buy new caps.

My point is that if one were looking to really be truly "independent" in terms of making beer (i.e. - growing your own grains, hops, washing & storing various yeast strains, etc.).... I would lean toward using mason jars to store the beer. Why?? Because I cannot make caps easily.

I'm perhaps looking at this from a different angle than others are. I'm looking at jars from a SHTF scenario, while others are looking at cans for nostalgic reasons.

But I'm still wondering how my great-grandmother bottled/canned that beer 80-90 years ago....
__________________

I've done all the work solely on intuition, without hydrometer.
-- Maegnar

+ Yeast Washing Illustrated -- REVISITED!!
+ Super Simple 15G Plastic Conical -- REVISITED

grndslm is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 09:26 AM   #17
emjay
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
emjay's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 12,694
Liked 1712 Times on 1601 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grndslm
Bulk priming is the ONLY way to go. We're using 5-oz of sugar for our 5-gal batches.

I'm willing to bet that if we switched to 3-oz of sugar for our 5-gal batches to go into STANDARD mason jars.

STANDARD mason jars could be had for incredibly reasonable prices at ANY grocery store in the world....

Twelve - 32 ounce mason jars with INFINITELY reusable lids... for $11

Two of those 12-packs for $22 and you're good for a 5-gal batch.

That's "better" than me having to drive to another state where I can buy bottles, or paying $2.75 for a 22-oz of Sam Adams. Twenty-nine 22-oz bottles (enough for a 5-gal batch) of Sam Adams would cost $80. And THEN one would still need a capper, and would need to continually buy new caps.

My point is that if one were looking to really be truly "independent" in terms of making beer (i.e. - growing your own grains, hops, washing & storing various yeast strains, etc.).... I would lean toward using mason jars to store the beer. Why?? Because I cannot make caps easily.

I'm perhaps looking at this from a different angle than others are. I'm looking at jars from a SHTF scenario, while others are looking at cans for nostalgic reasons.

But I'm still wondering how my great-grandmother bottled/canned that beer 80-90 years ago....
When I say bulk carbonating, I don't mean bulk priming. I mean you'd have to fully carbonate the beer *before* putting it in jars. The easiest way to do so is with a kegging setup. And if you have kegs, you're probably not bottling a ton of beer for yourself, and people just tend to use growlers (which also have reusable caps) in that case anyways.

And standard mason jars can be had for a reasonable price, sure. But that's a tad irrelevant, since standard mason jars are (as mentioned) highly prone to exploding if you try to carbonate it in the jar. They're not made to withstand internal pressure because manufacturers obviously don't count on people trying to carbonate in them.

If you just want something really cheap and reusable, plastic soda bottles make far more sense. They can hold more pressure than even the best beer bottles.

Anyways, this has gotten terribly off-topic. As somebody else already pointed out, this is not the kind of "canning" that this thread is about, and arguing is kind of pointless because if you really want to carbonate in mason jars, I can't stop you. So if you decide to do so, please just take every safety precaution you possibly can. Exploding glass bottles (or jars) can seriously injure someone, take out an eye or two, or even be fatal.
__________________
emjay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 02:06 PM   #18
SouthBay
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 465
Liked 23 Times on 21 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgilmore View Post
The mobile canning company is a startup by some of my son's college buddies. Lots of advantages for a small batch brewery to can their products to market. I think it's a great idea and if or when I get bigger at this, I would do it too. the can 'art" is pretty good with the product they've canned so far.
Props to your kids' friends. I thought it was a brilliant idea. And, it got me thinking about whether there'd be a way to make pre-sanitized aluminum cans that a homebrewer could use to put their stuff in. besides the logistics of the sanitization, i was trying to wrap my head around how you could 'cap' the can.

anyways, just a thought
__________________
SouthBay is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 02:07 PM   #19
PhelanKA7
Relax? RELAX?!
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
PhelanKA7's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Indy
Posts: 994
Liked 100 Times on 77 Posts
Likes Given: 202

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikescooling
Hey guys, I thinks some us are talking about canning in mason jar and others in steel cans. When I was little, 1982 dad opened his beer with a "church-key". I'd buy steel canned beer, just to back in time.
Can seamers are usually prohibitively expensive.
__________________
http://beerismypassion.com
PhelanKA7 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2012, 02:52 PM   #20
grndslm
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 228
Liked 22 Times on 9 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
When I say bulk carbonating, I don't mean bulk priming. I mean you'd have to fully carbonate the beer *before* putting it in jars.
Ahh.... gotcha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
And if you have kegs, you're probably not bottling a ton of beer for yourself, and people just tend to use growlers (which also have reusable caps) in that case anyways.
But the kegs require CO2, and the growlers eventually require new gaskets.

I guess perhaps the mason jar lids will compress to a point where they will actually need to be replaced, but I've never personally seen one that needed replacing. Don't use them all the time, tho.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
If you just want something really cheap and reusable, plastic soda bottles make far more sense. They can hold more pressure than even the best beer bottles.
This is likely the most "reusable" solution there is, but the taste only seems to be acceptable to me for, at most, a couple weeks after bottle conditioning has finished.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emjay View Post
arguing is kind of pointless because if you really want to carbonate in mason jars, I can't stop you. So if you decide to do so, please just take every safety precaution you possibly can. Exploding glass bottles (or jars) can seriously injure someone, take out an eye or two, or even be fatal.
Do you know the difference between an argument and a discussion???

Thank you for the tips. I will definitely place them in bags inside boxes inside bags inside boxes. I think I'll work from 2.5-oz of priming sugar [for 5-gal], upward by .5-oz for each batch. There must be a limit in which the mason jars DO work. There must be. It could be a fine line, but it must exist. (would you prefer to discuss this instead of argue about it, tho?)

I'm actually curious how long the lids would seal. I think they might seal a couple times with the positive pressure, but I don't believe they'd seal FOREVER like I initially stated.

Anyway, don't mind me. I'm just discussing in the same place that inspired this tangent.
__________________

I've done all the work solely on intuition, without hydrometer.
-- Maegnar

+ Yeast Washing Illustrated -- REVISITED!!
+ Super Simple 15G Plastic Conical -- REVISITED

grndslm is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Canning beer at home WIBeerGeek General Beer Discussion 26 03-26-2012 01:03 AM
preparing wort and canning for future yeast starters beerhound28 General Beer Discussion 4 01-10-2012 12:55 PM
Like it in the can? Sierra Nevada to join the ranks of canning craft brews. Revvy General Beer Discussion 53 05-29-2011 12:58 PM
Canning Malt Extract shazster General Beer Discussion 16 02-04-2011 09:02 PM
Pressure Canning Wort - is this right? Griffsta General Beer Discussion 2 06-13-2009 12:54 PM