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Old 10-10-2011, 04:03 AM   #11
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I didn't assume anything about your post at all. My post was not even a response to yours. The OP's question was pretty specific in looking for the differences between the methods commercially. Furthermore, I specifically addressed commercial applications and was very clear that I did not believe extract beers are inherently bad.

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Old 10-10-2011, 04:05 AM   #12
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You are assuming that I meant an inferior product because of the use of extract. It looks like this is turning into another one of those debates on quality of extract vs AG brews
Not assuming, just pulling from personal experience. Brewpubs who are shortcutting the setup cost, generally shortcut everything resulting in a lower quality product.
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Old 10-10-2011, 04:31 AM   #13
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Kelly's around here I think does some extract. Their beers taste like they don't care about the product, and when I complained about a bad beer once the waitress chastised me for complaining about the beer that *she* made. I can only imagine that's extract.

Yea. Place has a killer atmosphere and location, so I guess that they don't care about their beer too much.

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Old 10-10-2011, 04:44 AM   #14
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[quote=Airborneguy;3373318] Now I'm certainly not saying that extract beers are inherently bad.[QUOTE]

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You are assuming that I meant an inferior product because of the use of extract.
you see where your statement isn't true?

no one thinks that extract beers are "inferior" (atleast no one who isn't a newb who just switched to AG ["omg! my beers are so awesome now"]) it's just that it usually doesn't make sense for a brewpub. except for one that is looking to save costs up front (could be other reasons, just not USUALLY). for homebrewers there are plenty of reasons to brew extracts. ease, time, space, lots of things. point is that most people aren't trying to bash extract brewers.
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I'm getting ingredients in the mail today, and I can't even taste my beer yet. What should I do?
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I would make a yeast starter, and pitch it into your mailbox.
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Old 10-10-2011, 01:42 PM   #15
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Airborneguy, my apologies if I misunderstood your post. After reading it and rereading it yet again, I still get the impression that you meant to imply that a brewpub who is brewing with extract is cutting costs and quality will suffer. By saying "extract beers aren't inherently bad" just doesn't translate into extract beers can be equally as good as the best all grain brews.
I just did a quick search of the forums and there have been several posts on this exact subject. There are at least several places who are using extract due to space limitations or due to prohibitive costs of disposing spent grain.
Here is one such post:
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/do-p...94/index3.html
As to the OP's question, I could care less if the brewpub uses extract as long as the beer is good. If you want to open a brewpub using extract only, I think it's completely doable and you can do it without worrying about "compromising quality".

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Old 10-10-2011, 01:50 PM   #16
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i would question their motives for using extract (if they even told me they used it), but i would certainly drink the beers (if they were good beers). if the reason was due to space, etc., what ever, then i would understand. as long as the creative process was there then i could see me drinking it. if it was just kind of a gimmick where the pub wanted to mix up some syrup and water to make beer, then no. i think it depends on you're outlook on brewing, whether or not it will work

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I would make a yeast starter, and pitch it into your mailbox.
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Old 10-10-2011, 02:21 PM   #17
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Rycov, I could care less if people are bashing extract brewers. Please don't assume from my low number of posts that I am a "newb" on a rant to argue that my beers are equal with AG. I made my original post in order to provide the OP with a different perspective from the other responses. It IS doable. This whole concept has been done successfuly already. People sitting around saying that it can't be done with much of a margin for profit or implying that the product will not be on par with a traditional brewery is misleading. I'll be sure not to intervene next time I see responses to a poster's question being answered so one-sidedly. Also, I don't particularly appreciate you saying my statement was untrue. He in no way acknowledged that the extract brewery's product could be equal in quality and went on to talk about the importance of not cutting costs and the resulting decrease in quality. Doesn't sound like he thought too favorably about extract brewing now does it?

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Old 10-10-2011, 03:27 PM   #18
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Airborneguy, my apologies if I misunderstood your post. After reading it and rereading it yet again, I still get the impression that you meant to imply that a brewpub who is brewing with extract is cutting costs and quality will suffer. By saying "extract beers aren't inherently bad" just doesn't translate into extract beers can be equally as good as the best all grain brews.
You seem to be taking this personally, and I don't see why. The post above this one in response to rycov was obviously personal.

I've been to almost 100 brewpubs and/or breweries. My wife and I make it a priority whenever we travel to hit as many as possible. I've been to 2 that use extract (as I said, one made it clear, one wouldn't say but it was obvious because they had no equipment and said they brewed in their kitchen.) Oddly enough, both are in Ithaca, NY.

Now what I was getting at is that COMMERCIALLY, extract brewing is not the most popular, profit friendly way to brew beer for sale. My statements to this effect are not directed at the homebrewing of extract beers in the slightest. Commercial brewing and homebrewing have NOTHING in common. No one called you a newbie, no one even knew whether you brewed extract or AG!

The facts speak for themselves: only a very, very small percentage of brewpubs/breweries brew with extract. I am sure there are some out there that chose to do it for good reasons and produce fine beer. But if you can't recognize that there are people brewing beer commercially only because they felt it could make them more money than buying from a distributor, and chose extract because it is easy and equipment-lite, then you don't know much about how some business people think.

Not all people who are brewing beer commercially are actually brewers. Unfortunately, a few times I've found that out after it was too late.
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Old 10-10-2011, 10:34 PM   #19
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I agree with pretty much everything you just posted. I think where we differ is that I feel it is more viable commercially than you do. Fair enough. I don't particularly care. It just felt like, after my initial post outlining some of the potential benefits, you had quality concerns (which is understandable). I wasn't factoring in quality, as I didn't see the relevence. I just assumed that the product in question would have been of sufficient quality. It frustrated me because it seemed like my entire post was disregarded because of these quality issues. I responded impolitely, and I apologize. Rycov just came along and pissed me off by claiming my statement wasn't true. Seemed pretty blatantly rude to me.
As a side note, pretty much all my extract beers have been inferior to my AG brews. It's not an entirely fair comparison as I never did full boils while making extract and there were a few other small differences between processes. I'm a bit of a penny pincher and now stick to mainly AG. I enjoy the process and don't mind the extra time invested. Commercially though, for a small, start-up brewery I think the initial savings in equipment as well as the time savings help even the field. Keep in mind, I am refering to a small, pico or nano size brewery. Another thing to consider is any small scale, all grain system employed will eventually have to be replaced by a larger system if the business is successful and demand grows. The savings in grain in that initial time period may not be justified.

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Old 10-10-2011, 10:37 PM   #20
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I really need to break up my posts more. That big block of words is pretty hard on the eyes

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