Kegconnection Complete Starter Kit and More Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Beer Discussion > Article about Sierra Nevada brewing green

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-12-2009, 02:46 AM   #51
DtownRiot
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Pa
Posts: 100
Default

One important thing to think about here that has been mentioned is this. If this move to more efficient production lowers production costs, why won't the price decrease? I hate to think that these companies who go energy efficient will actually raise there prices in the next few years despite their lowered costs. It is capitalism in the best sense of the word. an example comes to mind... My college has repeatedly asked students to give them suggestions on how to improve their efficiency to cut costs of operating the school.Let's assume that many people make suggestions that lead to a big savings....my tuition won't go down one bit regardless. same as SN. think about it, if were are being more efficient, where are the savings? I know it takes time for the new tech to pay for itself...but does anyone honestly believe that they will spend less on beer rather than more from Sn in five years? Don't argue inflation. I bet the price will increase by five dollars in the next five years

__________________
DtownRiot is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 03:20 AM   #52
ArcaneXor
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,348
Liked 70 Times on 68 Posts
Likes Given: 11

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DtownRiot View Post
I know it takes time for the new tech to pay for itself...but does anyone honestly believe that they will spend less on beer rather than more from Sn in five years? Don't argue inflation. I bet the price will increase by five dollars in the next five years
SN and other breweries that use renewable energy sources to run their breweries don't charge any more than other craft breweries, and once the equipment is installed, the cost to run these systems is pretty low. I wouldn't expect their prices to increase any more or less than the industry as a whole.

And as long as people are willing to pay, there is no incentive for SN or other breweries to lower their prices. They pocket any savings (or re-invest it into their operation) and don't piss off their competitors by starting an unsustainable price war that would force everyone to lower production costs or to go out of business, which in turn would result in lower quality beer for the consumer. That would hurt the whole industry, since their raison d'etre is that they produce a premium, high quality product.

That's not to say that craft breweries don't compete with each other at all (quite to the contrary), but as with most luxuries, their producers rarely play by the same rules as mass market businesses do.
__________________
The Fiesty(sic) Goat Brewery est. 2007 & Clusterfuggle Experimental Ales est. 2009
Planned: sLambic II, Flanders Red II
Primary: Saison, Berliner Weisse, Dark Mild, sLambic I
Secondary: Orange Blossom Mead, Flanders Red I
Kegged: Fat Man Porter w/ 1469, Fat Man Porter w/ 005, Centennial Falcon w/ Conan, Centennial Falcon w/ Denny's, Barrel-aged Fat Man Porter, Belgian Dark Strong
Bottled: Flanders Red I
ArcaneXor is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 03:19 PM   #53
TwoHeadsBrewing
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chico, CA
Posts: 3,930
Liked 27 Times on 25 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

I suppose Sierra Nevada could change their course, but they have historically been very cheaply priced compared to other micros. That is one of the nice things about being privately held, and family owned. You don't have to worry about shareholder wealth, share price, or any of the bullshiite that comes with being publicly traded. The first time they raised prices in over 10 years was a couple years ago, and it went up from $4.99/sixer to $5.99 (at least locally). Even for Celebration and other seasonals, I've never seen it for more than $6.99. For the quality beer they produce, that's a damn good deal. If they wanted to charge $7.99/six, people would still buy it. But I seriously doubt I'll see prices like that in the next 10 years.

I think the price people see across the nation has more to do with the distributors than with Sierra Nevada. You don't put in solar, hydrogen fuel cells, and use biodiesel if you're into making a quick profit. It's an investment in the future of the company, and the earth which suggests a different kind of motive.

__________________

Fermenting: ESB
Kegged: Extra IPA, Brown Ale, American Wheat, Blackheart Stout
Coming Up: Dunkleweizen, 3C Pale Ale


DIY Fermentation Chamber
More Brew Stuff
TwoHeadsBrewing is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 04:10 PM   #54
ThickHead
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
ThickHead's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,010
Liked 45 Times on 30 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

The market drives price, not cost. SN might not have "shareholders" but they certainly have stakeholders and the obligations are not too disimilar. SN is a quality product that is reasonably priced within its market. Going green and improving profitablility without lowering quality or increasing cost is a win, win. If you want cheaper beer, make it yourself.

Kudos to SN!

Quote:
I think the price people see across the nation has more to do with the distributors than with Sierra Nevada. You don't put in solar, hydrogen fuel cells, and use biodiesel if you're into making a quick profit. It's an investment in the future of the company, and the earth which suggests a different kind of motive.
Well stated.
__________________
ThickHead is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 04:28 PM   #55
Brewin_the_goods
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 106
Default

Hell yeah, go SN. These guys make a quality drink (my personal favorite PA) and their price is hella cheap, just $1.20 per beer, which is only .30 cents more than it costs to brew my own. Hopefully this willl pave the way for other breweries to follow suit so that the prices will stay what they are and not inflate.

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by sundaybrewingco View Post
Sam Adams Cranberry Lambic made me want to punch myself in the face for drinking it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2bluewagons View Post
homebrew is for sharing. A$$hole brothers are for punching. See if you can cleverly combine the two.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salanis View Post
And Jesus too. He loved wine. Total party guy. Rolls into a party, "What, all you have is water?!? Wine, bitches!"
Brewin_the_goods is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 04:46 PM   #56
arturo7
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
arturo7's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Huntington Beach
Posts: 9,027
Liked 142 Times on 112 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

If SN sees any financial benefit from this system it won't be until 10 years down the road. That installation likely cost them several million dollars and they probably financed it.

Before they were pulling power off the grid, paying for it month by month. Now they are paying principal + interest every month. I'd guess it's a wash.

__________________

Hey, knock that shvt off. We're drinkin' here.

arturo7 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 05:15 PM   #57
ThickHead
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
ThickHead's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,010
Liked 45 Times on 30 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arturo7 View Post
If SN sees any financial benefit from this system it won't be until 10 years down the road. That installation likely cost them several million dollars and they probably financed it.

Before they were pulling power off the grid, paying for it month by month. Now they are paying principal + interest every month. I'd guess it's a wash.
The quote below is from a podcast of an interview with the with Sierra Nevada's Sustainability Coordinator, Cheri Chastain:

Quote:
TH: And when you consider the cost of installing these various renewable energy systems and the amount that you’re actually saving in energy expenses each year, what is the ROI? What sort of return on investment are you looking at?

CC: Sure. The return on investment for both the solar panels and the fuel cells is roughly six to seven years each, so the fuel cells have been up and running for about two and a half years, so we’ve got another four and a half or so years left on that investment. That investment period -- that payback period -- was made possible because of rebates and tax credit and tax incentives. We had some rebates from the local utility. We also had some rebates from the Department of Defense, so that helped out significantly.

The solar installation also has a roughly six to seven year payback period at this time, and, of course, all of this is pending what electricity prices are gonna be and that kind of thing.
Source: From Suds to Solar: The Greening of Sierra Nevada Brewing Co. | GreenBiz.com

The largest challenge for Sierra Nevada in terms of reducing its environmental impact is in the distribution process, namely transportation of product.
__________________

Last edited by ThickHead; 08-12-2009 at 05:49 PM.
ThickHead is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-12-2009, 05:16 PM   #58
TwoHeadsBrewing
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chico, CA
Posts: 3,930
Liked 27 Times on 25 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Just found this: http://www.chpcentermw.org/rac_profi...ewery_v1_2.pdf

For the hydrogen fuel cells the cost was $7mil over 5 years. Energy savings were estimated at $400k/year. With incentives from PG&E and government, their expected payback for the investment is 5 years.

Ken Grossman interview: http://www.lotusguide.com/interviews/443-kengrossman

__________________

Fermenting: ESB
Kegged: Extra IPA, Brown Ale, American Wheat, Blackheart Stout
Coming Up: Dunkleweizen, 3C Pale Ale


DIY Fermentation Chamber
More Brew Stuff

Last edited by TwoHeadsBrewing; 08-12-2009 at 05:19 PM.
TwoHeadsBrewing is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
All-Grain - High Sierra (Sierra Nevada) Pale Ale The Pol Recipes/Ingredients 45 05-04-2013 06:50 PM
Beer Camp! At Sierra Nevada Brewing Co. TwoHeadsBrewing General Beer Discussion 12 04-24-2009 03:19 AM
Sierra Nevada ESB BrianTheBrewer Commercial Brew Discussion 4 02-18-2009 09:32 PM
sierra nevada spottedbass Recipes/Ingredients 6 12-11-2007 02:52 PM
some sierra nevada? Rico6115 General Beer Discussion 5 09-07-2007 09:50 PM