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Old 06-25-2013, 06:25 PM   #131
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For some reason I can never get the cone at the bottom. I will remove everything from the kettle and get it spinning as fast as possible with the spoon then let it sit (with nothing in the kettle except the wort) for 30 min and I still never get a cone. I use a hop bag while boiling so I dont have anything but hot and cold break in there at the end, and I get the wort down to mid 60s in about 20 minutes so I think I am getting a sufficient cold break. No idea why I can never get the cone :/ I am thinking I just dont have enough sediment in there to actually for a cone and the cold and hot break by itself isnt dense enough to just clump together in the bottom center. Thoughts?

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Old 06-26-2013, 01:55 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by solavirtus
Thanks winvarin. I'll give something like that a try on the next batch. I only have the single port on my kettle, so I may just try without removing the chiller or removing it and just running the return hose back into the kettle securing it to the rim somehow.
I've heard JZ say on his podcast that he can get a cone with that chiller in place. I mainly took it out because I had both options by having 2 ports. I'd be willing to give it another shot with the chiller still in place.
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Old 06-26-2013, 01:59 AM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jglazer
For some reason I can never get the cone at the bottom. I will remove everything from the kettle and get it spinning as fast as possible with the spoon then let it sit (with nothing in the kettle except the wort) for 30 min and I still never get a cone. I use a hop bag while boiling so I dont have anything but hot and cold break in there at the end, and I get the wort down to mid 60s in about 20 minutes so I think I am getting a sufficient cold break. No idea why I can never get the cone :/ I am thinking I just dont have enough sediment in there to actually for a cone and the cold and hot break by itself isnt dense enough to just clump together in the bottom center. Thoughts?
I think leaving the hops free floating is the key to getting a cone. The hops form the solid cone and some of the break matter clings to it. Even with my cone, I still have some cold break at the bottom of the kettle
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Old 06-26-2013, 03:33 AM   #134
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I gave up on whirlpooling and just use a hop taco. Much easier

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Old 06-26-2013, 05:16 AM   #135
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I think leaving the hops free floating is the key to getting a cone. The hops form the solid cone and some of the break matter clings to it. Even with my cone, I still have some cold break at the bottom of the kettle
Interesting concept. I'll have to try this on my next brew and see if it changes things for me. I usually use hop bags and also can't seem to get a good cone.
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Old 07-23-2013, 03:22 AM   #136
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For what it's worth, I can usually get a decent cone but I'm using 6+ oz hops in the boil of many of my 5 gallon batches so I still end up with a nice pile of hops and break going in the fermenter using the valve on the bottom of my kettle. Sanitizing/cleaning a siphon and extra hose on brew day is the last thing I feel like doing when there is so much other stuff to clean up.

In the end, I've decided the hops and sludge really doesn't seem to hurt the final product. My first brews I used a hop bag, then on to a paint strainer bag, then on to a hop spider. Now I just toss everything right in the boil, whirlpool with the immersion chiller and open the valve up, tipping the kettle towards the end. A bunch ends up in the fermenter, but it all settles out during a 3 week primary. My IPAs usually end up with a half gallon of gunk and yeast at the bottom of the fermenter, but the positives are I'm not wasting any wort, I am getting a crystal clear beer after a couple weeks in the keg, I don't have a paint strainer bag to clean and I know I'm getting 100% hop utilization. I can't really think of any negatives other than it's a little more difficult to harvest yeast. Anyone else practice this?

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Old 01-28-2014, 10:01 PM   #137
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So here is my yesterday experience. It may not be entirely on-topic, but it leads to a discussion about whirlpool that I had with my friend, so please bother with me.

I brewed a SMaSH experiment using Target hops and a peat smoked malt from a certain Czech malting company, to see how much smoke intensity and what smoke character I would get.
Pre-boil the wort was pretty clear, actually I think my clearest yet (I am currently focusing on getting the lautering process done as good as possible). Unfortunately I did not take any pictures, but you can believe me, it was pretty clear.
I moved it to my boil kettle, made a normal boil, adding only hops. After the boil I chilled the wort pretty fast (some 15 minutes to 20-30°C).
Next I whirlpooled and everything went fine, hops formed a nice cone some 15 mins later.
BUT here is the problem - at some point during the boil the wort got pretty cloudy and it never cleared again.

Later that day I sat in a pub with my friend, who studies brewing in school and described to him my process.

He was quite surprised, that I whirlpool AFTER chilling, since all the breweries whirlpool BEFORE chilling and pointed that out to me as an obvious mistake.

I can pretty much understand, why anyone using a plate chiller (all commercial breweries AFAIK) would want to separate the wort from hops trub and hot break before sending it to the chiller.

But I did not get the reason why it would matter for anyone on a homebrew scale, who uses immersion chiller. Our aim, if I understand it correctly, is to ideally remove all the trub, consisting hops material, hot break, AND cold break if it is possible (and it indeed is, by chilling BEFORE whirlpooling).

He still argued his point, that it is better to whirlpool at near boiling temperatures and THEN chill, because of air exposure at cool temperatures the other way around.

I went through this thread and seen some advantages to both pre-chill and post-chill whirlpooling. As usual, my search for an answer to single question did not bring forth a definite answer, only more confusion with addition of another solution into the mix - whirlpool WHILE chilling, which seems to combine the best of both.

So I call out to the great minds of brewing on this forum to help me getting this thing straight.
To whirlpool or not to whirlpool, that is not the question But do it before, after, or while chilling? What are the proven (ideally)pros and cons to each?

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Old 01-28-2014, 10:12 PM   #138
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So here is my yesterday experience ... brewed a SMaSH experiment using Target hops and a peat smoked malt from a certain Czech malting company, to see how much smoke intensity and what smoke character I would get ...


Heck, I didn't even think peat had any diastatic power?
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Old 01-28-2014, 10:54 PM   #139
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A thing I learned pretty fast is that the smoke intensity will be pretty low.
1. tasting raw
2. observing the dust aroma while milling
3. aroma and taste of the wort pre-boil. It was actually lower in intensity than my previous beer with 81% weyermann smoked malt (they use birch if I am not mistaken EDIT:they use beech actually)
Also I was forced to leave the milled grain sit for some 40hrs. But we are a bit off-topic

But since you speak about diastatic power - I did no research in this, but I believe there is no reason why smoking over peat would affect malt's diastatic power in any way. That would give the brewers in history a bit of a hard time (well they might not use peat, but I do not see why that should matter either)

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Old 01-29-2014, 01:31 PM   #140
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But since you speak about diastatic power - I did no research in this, but...
Diastatic Power 0.0%


but it could depend on the malster?
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