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Old 07-21-2012, 07:31 PM   #1
Vertra
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Default Where to put my saison?

So we just had a massive heat wave here in the Midwest and my Saison was fermenting at a solid 93 degrees in my garage for that time (thank you mother nature). I havent taken gravity but I pitched well over what was needed to get the job done. The bubbles completely stopped after day 3 and it is now day 6 so I am contemplating moving it back into my basement with my other fermenters at a stable 68 degrees for the yeast to settle out and clarify. Is this a good idea or should I leave it in the hot environment until im ready to bottle it?

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Old 07-21-2012, 07:34 PM   #2
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No, don't do that. You need to check gravity as I'm almost certain it's nowhere near done. What strain did you use? You don't want to cool it down until the yeast have done their jobs - that leads to poor attenuation and off flavors. If this is the DuPont strain I can almost guarantee you are still sitting in the 1030 range - its a slow mama jamma!

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Old 07-21-2012, 11:14 PM   #3
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I used WLP566

Saison strain with more fruity ester production than with WLP565. Moderately phenolic, with a clove-like characteristic in finished beer flavor and aroma. Ferments faster than WLP565.
Attenuation: 78-85%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 68-78 F
Alcohol Tolerance: Medium

I also pitched a -ton- of this yeast. A brew master friend of mine pulled this off of his commercial sized conical fermenter and gave it to me for this beer specifically. He said it was enough to probably ferment 20 gallons, we pitched it into 10 gallons of 1.055 wort. I pitched it at 9PM and had huge bubbles in my blowoff bucket by midnight. I had never seen a fermentation start with only 2-3 hours of lag time; this thing was voracious.

I will check gravity before I move it for sure, but lets just say hypothetically I go check it and its at 1.004~1.006. Would it be okay to move it then?

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Old 07-22-2012, 03:09 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertra
I used WLP566

Saison strain with more fruity ester production than with WLP565. Moderately phenolic, with a clove-like characteristic in finished beer flavor and aroma. Ferments faster than WLP565.
Attenuation: 78-85%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 68-78 F
Alcohol Tolerance: Medium

I also pitched a -ton- of this yeast. A brew master friend of mine pulled this off of his commercial sized conical fermenter and gave it to me for this beer specifically. He said it was enough to probably ferment 20 gallons, we pitched it into 10 gallons of 1.055 wort. I pitched it at 9PM and had huge bubbles in my blowoff bucket by midnight. I had never seen a fermentation start with only 2-3 hours of lag time; this thing was voracious.

I will check gravity before I move it for sure, but lets just say hypothetically I go check it and its at 1.004~1.006. Would it be okay to move it then?
I've never used the WLP version, but believe this is one and the same as DuPont. Can't validate that but it comes with the same warning from White Labs. (below)

I'd definitely check gravity but guessing you are just stalled. I have a Saison in primary that got pure oxygen, nutrients, and a 3 liter starter. Fermented like mad for 3 days, then slowed to a crawl and dropped Kraussen. Gravity was 1031 and it's been slowly chipping a way for 3 weeks now. I'd leave it sit and insure its done before you drop out of the higher temps - although 90's is probably too warm anyway and your going to get some hot alcohol.

"In Focus: Belgian Saison I

WLP565 Belgian Saison I Yeast
Classic Saison yeast from Wallonia. It produces earthy, peppery, and spicy notes. Slightly sweet. With high gravity saisons, brewers may wish to dry the beer with an alternate yeast added after 75% fermentation.
Attenuation: 65-75%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 68-75°F
Alcohol Tolerance: Medium

Note to brewers: This strain tends to stall out in fermentation and then restart as long as two weeks later. Make sure the wort is well-oxygenated and allow the temperature to free rise in order to ensure complete fermentation. Some brewers add WLP001 to finish.
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Old 07-22-2012, 08:53 AM   #5
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To be clear, I used 566, not 565. 565 is the one that god a bad wrap for sticking at 1.030. WLP566 is supposed to finish very fast and dry. Also considering I pitched 5000-600ml of high concentrated slurry when 250ml would have probably been adequate... I don't expect this to take more than 7 days to completely finish primary.

So the question still stands... if a saison is finished with active fermentation is it alright to move it to a cooler environment (67-69F) in order to clarify, or should it stay in a heated environment for the complete duration until bottling?

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Old 07-22-2012, 02:27 PM   #6
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If it is finished it will not hurt anything to move it.

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Old 07-22-2012, 02:29 PM   #7
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Obviously I was needing my glasses and another cup of coffee yesterday. how I missed that in your original response is beyond me! Yes, if finished you can definitely move it to a cooler spot. Sorry about that!

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Old 07-22-2012, 04:04 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makomachine View Post
No, don't do that. You need to check gravity as I'm almost certain it's nowhere near done. What strain did you use? You don't want to cool it down until the yeast have done their jobs - that leads to poor attenuation and off flavors. If this is the DuPont strain I can almost guarantee you are still sitting in the 1030 range - its a slow mama jamma!
I know the Dupont strain has sticking issues, but doesn't Dupont ferment their beers around 90 F to get them done in less than a week

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertra View Post
I used WLP566

Saison strain with more fruity ester production than with WLP565. Moderately phenolic, with a clove-like characteristic in finished beer flavor and aroma. Ferments faster than WLP565.
Attenuation: 78-85%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 68-78 F
Alcohol Tolerance: Medium

I also pitched a -ton- of this yeast. A brew master friend of mine pulled this off of his commercial sized conical fermenter and gave it to me for this beer specifically. He said it was enough to probably ferment 20 gallons, we pitched it into 10 gallons of 1.055 wort. I pitched it at 9PM and had huge bubbles in my blowoff bucket by midnight. I had never seen a fermentation start with only 2-3 hours of lag time; this thing was voracious.

I will check gravity before I move it for sure, but lets just say hypothetically I go check it and its at 1.004~1.006. Would it be okay to move it then?
If it is done, move it. If not leave it where it is warm.
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Old 07-22-2012, 04:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calder

I know the Dupont strain has sticking issues, but doesn't Dupont ferment their beers around 90 F to get them done in less than a week
Not very familiar with their process and that is likely correct. The problem is that all commercial breweries ferment much warmer than we do as home brewers - as their volumes and equipment allow them that liberty. At the scale we do at home, you'll end up with a fusely mess in most cases if you mirror what they do commercially. Now the DuPont strain is very tolerant of heat, I just wouldn't start it at those temperatures. Likely a major over pitch would make it ok as I've heard that the growth phase is where a lot of off flavors come from in fermentation. I'm a stickler for process and a bit anal about my brewing however, so take that for what it's worth!
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Old 07-22-2012, 05:45 PM   #10
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This brewmaster told me to pitch at 70-75ish, stick it in the garage and just let it happen. "If it gets to 100+, sweet." Thanks for the responses.

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